[FreeArticle] Post-6/20 Drain Tendrils: Staying Ahead of the Curve by Cody Vinci

[M.Solymossy]

I'm at a cross-roads because I really enjoy having the Green, because Fastbond acts as dark ritual.  That said, for some reason, I just cannot beat Control Slaver or Stax with Welder.  and the ONLY Card that has ever really been a problem is Sundering titan.  It's major frown towns.

[InfectedMushroom]

Instead of adding green, might the UBr version be more powerful against CS and Stax with Welder? You get very strong SB cards and other utility like Fire/Ice. In earlier pages, a couple solid deckliss are posted. Playing straight UB or UB with a splash or red or green may very well come down to more of a metagame and personal playstyle choice. I am currently playing UB but have toyed around with UBr. I always loved the utility red brings, although your mana base is a little bit weaker.

[M.Solymossy]

Having a 3rd color is not good against Stax or Slaver, no matter which way you look at it.  If you're going to play UBr to beat Stax and Slaver, just play SLAVER.  I  absolutely hate red.  It doesn't add anything to the deck except for rack and awful, Empty the Terrible, and Re-shat.

[bluemage55]

Having a 3rd color is not good against Stax or Slaver, no matter which way you look at it.  If you're going to play UBr to beat Stax and Slaver, just play SLAVER.  I  absolutely hate red.  It doesn't add anything to the deck except for rack and awful, Empty the Terrible, and Re-shat.

Maindeck Tormod's Crypt x1 + Darkblast x1 go a long way towards hating out Welder, and they're not particularly narrow cards either, so you don't lose much out on other matchups. 

Neither require that dreaded red splash.

[Ufactor]

I'm honestly confused at this point.  I don't know what to say about the control match.

Back in the day, when dinosaurs played Magic along side men, Slaver was a resilient, but completely beatable deck.  In those times, Drain Tendrils was called Hulk Smash.  AK/Intuition filled your hand with counters.  Cunning Wish with REB in the sideboard gave you more counters.  Merchant Scroll gave you even more counters after that.  At some point in the game, the Slaver player would find it absolutely impossible to resolve Thirst for Knowledge, and artifacts never got welded into play.

Now granted, that was a long time ago, and the meta game has gotten alot faster.  There are also no play sets of Scroll and Brainstorm to be relied upon.  I also have to empirical evidence to base this on - I have very little time for testing and it's usually on MWS.  Doesn't this theory of beating Slaver, however, still hold true?

[God_Campbell]

I think your idea about the Slaver match is still relevant, I just think painter is fast taking over slaver as the ideal Artifact control list.

But I can say that going BU also means you have access to 4 islands and can sit back on those vs a wasteland on the opposite side of the board, just this past weekend having a 4th island was the key to winning vs a smokestack and cow/waste board to my tinkered out Colossus.

I was going to test the green version this weekend, but I was just not feeling it, and I think the UB is the superior build in that you have a streamlined 2 tendrils main deck with access to a token dark ritual, and whether you are playing Scrying or Gifts the deck is just so robust even after siding in a tinker/colosi for the second tendrils, so the success with a different build was good to see but I will have to test the green version and get back to you on how i felt about it.

[M.Solymossy]

The real key, which I tried to hide from people, to adding green is actually REGROWTH.  That card is worth playing green for.  However, I'm going to 1x trop, 1x regrowth, 0x fastbond.

[Dante]

The real key, which I tried to hide from people, to adding green is actually REGROWTH.  That card is worth playing green for.  However, I'm going to 1x trop, 1x regrowth, 0x fastbond.

If you go to 1 trop you'll need to sideboard land to support Goyf.

[piZZero]

I've been testing the version with green and I have to say that it's more explosive than any other versions BUT:

1- Fastbond working as ritual, might lead you to an excessive amount of life loss that i noticed too often. Keep in mind that as a general rule, I tend not to use cards that punished my life a lot (i.e. Skeletal Scrying, Thoughtseize, Dark Confidants, etc...)

2- It makes me play less controlish, which i don't like. I like the deck coz the longest you hold your bombs, the more effective they become.

I've returned to the version with Dark Ritual instead of Fastbond. Post Will Ritual works as fine as fastbond with the advantage that you can combo out even if your life is low (against aggro decks, mostly).

I loved regrowth, but i missed recoup in Gifts piles.

All in all, i prefer better the version with red. Right now, i'm also testing Crypting Command + Misdirection instead of 2 Duress main deck (moving Duresses to the SB). I really like the results so far with the change.

Cheers!

piZZero - Jordi Amat

[Ufactor]

Deep Analysis Drain Tendrils. I’m fairly certain that Deep Analysis is better than AK’s in Drain Tendrils for most matches. Intuition AK is only good when you’ve got a second AK in hand or draw into it. Intuition DA always draws you up to 6 cards and lets you entomb your Tendrils/Lotus/Academy/Chain. DA has great synergy with TFK too.

In dropping the AK’s some additional space is freed up for more Duress effects.

Recoup has been tested and cut for Tinker-Titan. Titan makes the deck less Will dependant and gives the deck more quick, easy wins.

Mana 25
4 Underground Sea
4 Island
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
1 Tolarian Academy
5 Moxen
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Lotus Petal
1 Black Lotus
1 Mana Vault

Control 14
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Rebuild
4 Duress
4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will

Engine 18
4 Thirst For Knowledge
2 Deep Analysis
2 Intuition
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Time Walk
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Yawgmoth's Will

Kill 3
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Tinker
1 Titan

http://www.themanadrain.com/index.php?topic=36498.0

Has anyone tested this, yet?  Deep Analysis and Titan are gold against Slaver and TPS, but at the cost of weakening matches against Fish, Shop Aggro and Ichorid - Yuck!  I'm going to guess that Paint got worse here as well, because they also have the ability to win small with beaters.

Formerly, this deck went from doing next to nothing on turns 1&2, but then exploding on turns 3&4.  With the addition of Deep Analysis, this deck goes land-go, land-go, draw two cards, draw-two cards, bobble with Willenium.  Taking away explosiveness from this deck removes the ability to truely benefit from Yawgmoth's Will, and race when you're on a clock (i.e. deck with creatures and/or TPS after boarding).

Yes, there was a problem dealing with graveyard hate, but now that's been resolved.   The new problems in exchange are being out-brokened by someone who can use their Will turn faster than you, stalling on matches when you have the green light to win and an exacerbated weakness against dudes with disruption.

[2ndMain]

@ Ufactor
The list you posted above is the list that I play with against Becker.  Its a solid list that Eric has helped me tweak over the last month or so.  Having played both AK & DA, I can say that DA plays much better in almost all matches.  To quote Eric "Having DA in the yard is like having Ancestral in hand".  I haven't really tested much against Dredge or Shops, but the deck as is plays like a well oiled machine. 

[Neonico]

I totally disagree what you said about the comparaison between DA and AK.... In this deck, there are alot of thingyou can do with AK and not with DA, especially when you play 2 of them.

First, what is your draw intuition in your version of the deck ? Intuition for 2 DA + ???? I think that even in a DA shell, you have to play at least 3 DA, to grant a 4 cards advantage.... You'll have a DA in hand hand a misdirectable 4 CC card in hand, allmost allways meaning you'll need to drain something big to effectively start your draw engine. Otherwise, flashback the yard DA will only gives you 2 cards, where AK after intuition is at least 3, and ALL at instant speed.

Second : as noticed by piZZero, the life becomes more and more important in our format, especially in the european metagame, as shown in Eurovino.

Third : Actually, allmost all decks in developpement i actually see on all forums i browse (especially Tezzeret controle, which we have to prepare to faceseriously) tend to starting again to play Misdirection, not a good news for an intuition=>DA Engine

4th : once your draw engine is started (Post intuition), DA in the deck makes you loose alot of crucial plays, such as Merchant/Mystical for 4th AK, making those cards alot better than it would be in a DA version of the deck.

5th : marginal, but alot of players (at least here in france) got Jailer as their only graveyard hate. AK dodges that, not DA.

[Ufactor]

Second : as noticed by piZZero, the life becomes more and more important in our format, especially in the european metagame, as shown in Eurovino.

It seems like there is a serious disconnect between the European meta game and the North American one... well, even more so than usual.  It makes me wish that Toad/Mathieu still played Vintage : \

[OmniStrife_101]

Hi! This is my first post here and I was hoping you to get some input from you guys. 

I am from the Philippines and I was inspired to make a Drain Tendrils deck because of this thread,maybe moreso because of my resources.  I do not own the whole set of power (see my decklist) but I tried to test my build.  I just want the opinion of you masters on how to improve the build I made (weakness, strengths,or any comments will do)

The meta we have in the Philippines is pretty different.  We do not have a steady access to power cards but we do have some decks here that are powered, although most decks in local sanctioned tournaments are on a budget.  We have a steady mix of random aggro decks, fish type decks (especially U/W), Landstill type of decks (U/R, U/W etc) and ofcourse Oath.  We seldom have TPS, Control Slaver, in our tournaments although we do have a strong presence of Ichorid and Stax decks here.To sum it all up, its a pretty close fight between aggro and control decks in our Meta.

Here is my decklist

1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Pearl
1 Dark Ritual
2 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
4 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Tolarian Academy
6 Islands

4 Accumulated Knowledge
2 Intuition
1 Ancestral Recall
3 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Recoup

1 Rebuild
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Echoing Truth

4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
2 Duress
1 Thoughtseize

1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Tinker
1 Darksteel Colossus
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Yawgmoth's Will 

Sideboard:
Have not thought of it yet..

THOUGHTS:
1.  I wanted to use Mystical Tutor but I was not sure what to take out.  I wanted to take out Ponder but I was concerened about finding mana sources during the early game.  The thought of cutting Hurkyl's Recall also crossed my mind but I was not completely sure yet.

2.  Instead of going for Tinker>>Colossus, I wanted to try out Empty the Warrens but as some of you guys posted here, the tinker play really doesnt need any set up.  I was just concerened about the Meta here in the Philippines wherein you can get overwhelmed easily by creatures. I mean what does a lone 11/11 stand against hordes of creatures,wherein if I play Empty the Warrens, I can also play the defensive...but I am not completely convinced with my own arguement.

3.  Regarding the sideboard, since graveyard hate is prevalent here, I was thinking of a transformational SB wherein I put 3 Painter Servant and 2 Grindstone in the second game.  I was really concerned about this since when I playtested the list, 99% of the time, I won it via Yawgmoth's Will.  I do not kow if I am playing the deck wrong or anything.

PLAYTESTING:

So far I playtested the deck for over a week and I plan to bring it to our local tournament this coming Sunday. 

Possible problems:
1.  People here even pack maindeck Extirpates and post board Tormod's Crypt, and Leylines how do you even fight such hate?
2.  Is it really viable to play Drains Tendrils in such a meta?

Sorry if the questions are really newbish, this is actually my first post here, contstructive criticisms from you masters are highly appreciated..

Thanks!

[Neonico]

It makes me wish that Toad/Mathieu still played Vintage : \

Can i get the real meaning of this sentence please ?

[OmniStrife_101]

Guys, with the coming of new cards c/o Alara, will Drain Tendrils still be viable?

From my playtesting (see my list above) I really find it hard for the deck to have quick wins.  In other words, the clock is really slow.  What worries me is the rising hate for combo (ethersworn canonist) which really would make our lives miserable.  Although I have not yet had a match up with these new builds, I am not sure if I would be alarmed with these new cards.  Any thoughts?

I decided to tweak my initial build. 

1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Pearl
1 Dark Ritual
2 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
4 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Tolarian Academy
5 Islands

4 Accumulated Knowledge
2 Intuition
1 Ancestral Recall
2 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Recoup
1 Frantic Search

1 Rebuild
1 Chain of Vapor

4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
2 Duress
2 Thoughtseize

1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Tinker
1 Darksteel Colossus
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Yawgmoth's Will 
1 Empty the Warrens

New cards included:
Frantic Search - serves as my third Thirst for Knowledge.  This card really helps a lot come combo time and you need to reuse mana source (Tolarian Academy) to extend the spell count.
Empty the Warrens - I realized the for our meta here in the Philippines, 3 kill conditions are necessary.  During my playtesting, it has won me more games as compared to Tinker>D.S Colossus.  An early 6 spell count then Empty the Warrens can oftentimes be overwhelming for the opponent.
2 Duress effects to 4 Duress Effects - since the clock of the deck really is slow compared to the aggro ifested Meta we have, I decided to include Thoughtseizes. 

I am still torn between playing this build or any other builds for Drain Tendrils.  At once I was tempted to include main deck Fire/Ice to just take care of early threats such as Dark confidants, Goblin welders and the like..

your thoughts positive or negative will be highly appreciated...

[oathrulez]

Hi, i reply from Italy so basically i won't discuss any meta choice, even if they are so relevant especially in a deck Like Dt. BUT i tested long both the G and R version and i found that post Sb green leads me to draw too many games. Red has removals, green only posticipates the problem i think. Dropping a Goyf against aggro is really good but dont you usually prefer a pyroclasm? Trygon is awesome against Stax but isnt R&R lot better? maybe my playstyle leads me to these considerations but i still think that the correct way might be First:resolving a problem Second: comboing out with Tendrils, at very least against aggrocontrol or stax, the worst Mu we have at the moment i guess.

Hello, and welcome to the Mana Drain!  While we appreciate newer users contributing to discussions on the forums, we do ask that older threads that have been inactive for a month or longer be left dormant.  If you're interested in commenting on this subject, we suggest you try starting your own thread!  Please look over the site rules to avoid this problem going forward.  Good luck with future posting.  -DA