3 Card Game

[SiegeX]

How do you make a forum game out of it? Each person lists a 3-card set and then the next person lists their on 3-card set that beats it?

[AmbivalentDuck]

Assuming that The Rack is banned, here's my pile:

Karakas
Mishra's Factory
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale

Given the option, I always go second.  K, who has a pile that beats it?

[Delha]

Assuming that The Rack is banned, here's my pile:

Karakas
Mishra's Factory
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale

Given the option, I always go second.  K, who has a pile that beats it?

Show and Tell
Form of the Dragon
Lotus

Another fun one we came with a while back was this.

Lotus/Swamp - Sarcomancy - Tel-Jihad Stylus

Not a strong as the ones mentionned, but really goes outside the box.

It also beats 2 Racks, and draws with Tabernacle + Mishra's if you use the Swamp.

This is my new fav, btw. Glowrider/Pirate is still awesome, but the style points from this are just too cool.

How do you make a forum game out of it? Each person lists a 3-card set and then the next person lists their on 3-card set that beats it?

IIRC, the way the matchups worked, you do two games, alternating who gets the choice. Win/lose/draw is pretty clear from there.

[Wagner]

Another fun one we came with a while back was this.

Lotus/Swamp - Sarcomancy - Tel-Jihad Stylus

Not a strong as the ones mentionned, but really goes outside the box.

It also beats 2 Racks, and draws with Tabernacle + Mishra's if you use the Swamp.

This is my new fav, btw. Glowrider/Pirate is still awesome, but the style points from this are just too cool.

How do you make a forum game out of it? Each person lists a 3-card set and then the next person lists their on 3-card set that beats it?

IIRC, the way the matchups worked, you do two games, alternating who gets the choice. Win/lose/draw is pretty clear from there.

Wow, I'm a moron, Sarcomancy doesn't work with Lotus... Swamp FTW!

To make a forum game, you need someone to send your deck to that will calculate the matchups and post them after the deadline is met. Here is an example of how it looks. http://www.mtgquebec.com/viewtopic.php?t=2514&start=0

Just scroll down until you see the spreadsheet with the decks and then the results. No need to understand French to get this.

[Delha]

Lotus, Smallpox, Nether Spirit

Too bad Smalllpox doesn't hit enchants.

[TheShop]

Can't bounce stuff w /o leyline

None of the suggested kills have "haste."  You choose to go second if you win the coin flip and then play the correct answer.

yeah but nothing would be legendary except merit lage...so karakas would not work.  you might as well be playing a plains without the leyline.


Question:  Does leyline of anticipation, lotus, hymn to tourach tie pretty much everything?  City of traitors, time vault, key ties a good number of them too.

[Wagner]

Can't bounce stuff w /o leyline

None of the suggested kills have "haste."  You choose to go second if you win the coin flip and then play the correct answer.

yeah but nothing would be legendary except merit lage...so karakas would not work.  you might as well be playing a plains without the leyline.


Question:  Does leyline of anticipation, lotus, hymn to tourach tie pretty much everything?  City of traitors, time vault, key ties a good number of them too.

The first one doesn't tie with Neither Spirit or Force+ Arbor. The second one doesn't work under current stalling rules, I you don't want to get a judge called in this format.

[Delha]

[Question:  Does leyline of anticipation, lotus, hymn to tourach tie pretty much everything?  City of traitors, time vault, key ties a good number of them too.

The first one doesn't tie with Neither Spirit or Force+ Arbor. The second one doesn't work under current stalling rules, I you don't want to get a judge called in this format.

Actually both decks listed beat the City/Key/Vault. Smallpox eats your City, and FoW stops a piece. You also probably lose to any disruptive deck. Since you take two turns to get going, almost any deck with discard gets to nuke your hand and win at leisure.

If you want to run Hymn, I'd lean more towards Lotus/Hymn/Straw Golem or the like.

Addendum:
A couple more... Kinda mediocre though, I think.
Lotus/Magus of the Moon/Glowrider. I think you should be able to lock out pretty much any deck other than FoW/Dryad when on the draw. On the play, you'll lose a lot, but probably draw at least some.

Lotus/Blackmail/Mesmeric Fiend. Nothing special here, just another disruption variant. Same principle as the last one. You probably lock out the opp on the draw, and lose on the draw.

[AmbivalentDuck]

Can't bounce stuff w /o leyline

None of the suggested kills have "haste."  You choose to go second if you win the coin flip and then play the correct answer.

yeah but nothing would be legendary except merit lage...so karakas would not work.  you might as well be playing a plains without the leyline.

It's a corner case preventer.  Every pile but the Marit Lage pile that beats this starts with Lotus and Show and Tell for an enchantment or an indestructible creature.

I don't see how Marit Lage can beat this?  The token doesn't have haste and all three cards go into the combo.  You drop Karakas turn 1 and Tabernacle turn 2 in case the Hexmage sticks around.

[TheShop]

I didn't realize you were only running karakas to beat merit lage.

How bout:

leyline of anticipation, lotus, balance for a tiemaker(I know it doesn't work on everything).
And not that it matters but in the force+ arbor deck the blue card should be slippery bogle.

Here's another-
forest, scythe tiger(or whatever the new rogue elephant is called), reverent silence

[Will]

I remember this from the Source?  Some possibilities could be:
Lotus Show and Tell Terrastodon?
Anything with Energy Field was good I think?

[Godder]

When I ran 3CB here, decks had to be able to win - drawing decks weren't allowed. That said, Dodecapod usually beats Balance decks anyway.

Blackmail is an awesome card if it's allowed. Platinum Angel loses to Form of the Dragon.

Black Lotus, Blackmail, Ravenous Rats/Mesmeric Fiend will be strong going first, as would Lotus, Hymn to Tourach, Sarcomancy. A deck that always wins going first will do well in 3CB.

Assuming that The Rack is banned, here's my pile:

Karakas
Mishra's Factory
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale

Given the option, I always go second.  K, who has a pile that beats it?

Lotus, Blackmail, Ravenous Rats beats this going first (Blackmail targets Tabernacle, Rats just wins after that regardless of discard) and draws going second. Of the decks I remember, Strip Mine decks would beat this e.g. Strip Mine (or Wasteland), land, dude, as would the StP decks (StP, land, dude).

[TopSecret]

Gemstone Cavern
Dryad Arbor
Piracy Charm

[Will]

Gemstone Cavern
Dryad Arbor
Piracy Charm

Wouldn't that deck be better with something like Mishra's Factory? It seems pretty strong and with Factory you get a win instead of a draw against other Dryad Arbor decks and also gives you a draw instead of a loss vs. other Factory decks. 

[TopSecret]

Gemstone Cavern
Dryad Arbor
Piracy Charm

Wouldn't that deck be better with something like Mishra's Factory? It seems pretty strong and with Factory you get a win instead of a draw against other Dryad Arbor decks and also gives you a draw instead of a loss vs. other Factory decks.  

You're right. I totally overlooked that.


So I was thinking about this today and I think I may have more or less figured out this format. But it's totally possible I overlooked something.

There's only three different "archetypes" with a lot of permutations for each and different matchups based on the "metagame", but memorizing or looking at the individual matchups seems like a waste of time until a dominant combination appears or you're trying to predict the opponent:


1) Combo

Tries to do something ridiculous on turn one. Loses to Control. Beats Aggro.

Example: Lotus, Blackmail, Ravenous Rats

2) Control

Plays disruption on the opponent's first turn even on the draw. It's win condition is terrible. Beats Combo. Loses to Aggro.

Example: Force of Will, Slippery Bogle, Dryad Arbor

3) Aggro

Does not try to win on the first turn. Instead, avoids disruption and trumps control's win condition. Loses to Combo. Beats Control.

Example: Mishra's Factory, Mishra's Factory, Dryad Arbor

[Will]

I sort of agree but there are plenty of variants and subtle changes among archetypes from one cardset to another that it can' be broken up just like that.  For instance, what about combinations based on storage lands to cast fatties or unique things such as City of Traitors Isochron Scepter Lightning Helix.  As a whole, the format is too diverse until one thing comes out and shows that it can really win otherwise most people play their own build and everyone goes approximately .500.  After a few times of doing this the people who do the worst will abandon their ideas and the metagame shifts, it is generally a never-ending cycle especially since it feels like such a rock paper scissor game. 

[TopSecret]

I sort of agree but there are plenty of variants and subtle changes among archetypes from one cardset to another that it can' be broken up just like that.  For instance, what about combinations based on storage lands to cast fatties or unique things such as City of Traitors Isochron Scepter Lightning Helix.  As a whole, the format is too diverse until one thing comes out and shows that it can really win otherwise most people play their own build and everyone goes approximately .500.  After a few times of doing this the people who do the worst will abandon their ideas and the metagame shifts, it is generally a never-ending cycle especially since it feels like such a rock paper scissor game.  

Yeah, I agree. The Combo, Control, Aggro thing was the only pattern I could see. It's probably not even that useful of a distinction. The format seems absurdly random unless there's some kind of dominant combination that I am unaware of.

[Godder]

If you allow them, Shop decks normally do pretty well. Shop, 3Sphere, Steel Golem was always a strong contender in my experience, as was Shop, Golem, Phyrexian Warbeast.

[TheWhiteDragon]

Lotus, ancestral recall, mana drain (they have 0 cards in library = gg, lol)

[TheShop]

Lotus, ancestral recall, mana drain (they have 0 cards in library = gg, lol)

one of the rules is that needing to draw and not having a library does not lose in this format.

[Delha]

...Every pile but the Marit Lage pile that beats this starts with Lotus and Show and Tell for an enchantment or an indestructible creature.

Lotus/Hymn/Straw Golem beats you overall. You can always draw while on the play, but lose 2/3 of the time when going second (and draw the other 1/3 of the time).

Lotus/Magus/Glowrider beats you always.

[SiegeX]

I think this thread has enough interest to start up a game. Anybody here with experience running one of these willing to take the reigns?

[AmbivalentDuck]

With such a large dependence on Lotus piles, there's probably a place for Leyline of Anticipation, Chalice, Dryad Arbor

[SiegeX]

With such a large dependence on Lotus piles, there's probably a place for Leyline of Anticipation, Chalice, Dryad Arbor

Hah, you bastage. That was going to be my pile if/when there was a game started.

[Godder]

I think this thread has enough interest to start up a game. Anybody here with experience running one of these willing to take the reigns?

I stopped because I couldn't come up with a good theme for 3CB #100, which is what we're up to, and also because I've got much less time that I used to have, but I guess I could put together 3CB #100, provided someone can come up with something a little bit special to celebrate.

[Delha]

Cloudpost/Cloudpost/Rackling
If you want a fatty creature approach, there's Phyrexian Processor (or Eater of Days, but that's usually worse).


Addendum:
City of Traitors/Null Rod/Epochrasite
City over Shop lets you pay for Tabernacle. You can also swap in a Steel Overseer, or use Sphere + Straw Golem.
 

[thorme]

Blast from the past.  Here's an old thread on some of the older 3CB tournies on tmd:

http://www.themanadrain.com/index.php?topic=14457.0

[Killane]

Cloudpost/Cloudpost/Rackling
If you want a fatty creature approach, there's Phyrexian Processor (or Eater of Days, but that's usually worse).
 

Wouldn't Workshop/lotus/Rackling be strictly better as it gives you sufficient mana to pay for spell Pierce or Spheres should someone randomly be running those?

Is there a Boseiju for artifact or creature spells?

[Delha]

Cloudpost/Cloudpost/Rackling
If you want a fatty creature approach, there's Phyrexian Processor (or Eater of Days, but that's usually worse).

Wouldn't Workshop/lotus/Rackling be strictly better as it gives you sufficient mana to pay for spell Pierce or Spheres should someone randomly be running those?

Is there a Boseiju for artifact or creature spells?

Not strictly. I'm the only person to have mentioned spheres other than Trini at all, so I didn't figure many people would be running them. Tabernacle on the other hand, has come up a lot.

Random pile: LED, Forest, Roar of the Wurm.

[Norm4eva]

FWIW, when TMD held regular 3CB 'tournies' the banned list was about a mile long.  And it changed with every win; for example if someone took the last tourney with "LED, Arrogant Wurm, Basking Rootwalla", those three cards hit the banned list.  So you could get your sillies out by playing your Lotus-XXX-XXX decks, but after that you had to get creative.