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Author Topic: So I changed my General...  (Read 5196 times)
Sporkcore
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« on: December 08, 2010, 02:43:51 am »

From Karn to Arcum Dagsson.

The last bunch of times I've played EDH, I got picked on. Whether it was because of my general or I'm too good at the format or what, I was targeted first. I play multiplayer mostly and Karn isn't as good in multi as he is 1v1, so I'm going to give everyone a reason to hate me by trying to lock down the board as quickly as possible.

General:
Arcum Dagsson

Creature:
Trinket Mage

Artifact Creatures:
Arcbound Reclaimer
Duplicant
Epochrasite
Etherium Sculptor
Faerie Mechanist
Junk Diver
Karn, Silver Golem
Manakin
Master of Etherium
Master Transmuter
Millikin
Myr Retriever
Phyrexian Walker
Pilgrim's Eye
Platinum Angel
Scarecrone
Silver Myr
Solemn Simulacrum
Steel Overseer
Sundering Titan

Instants:
Echoing Truth
Ovinize
Thirst For Knowledge

Enchantment:
March of the Machines

Plainswalker:
Tezzeret the Seeker

Sorceries:
Argivian Restoration
Fabricate
Reshape
Thoughtcast
Transmute Artifact

Artifact:
Aether Spellbomb
Basalt Monolith
Clock of Omens
Contagion Engine
Crucible of Worlds
Darksteel Forge
Darksteel Ingot
Everflowing Chalice
Expedition Map
Fellwar Stone
Grim Monolith
Kill Switch
Lightning Greaves
Mana Crypt
Mana Vault
Mind Stone
Mindslaver
Mycosynth Lattice
Nevinyrral's Disk
Prismatic Lens
Rings of Brighthearth
Scroll Rack
Sculpting Steel
Sensei's Divining Top
Serum Tank
Skullclamp
Sol Ring
Thousand-Year Elixir
Voltaic Key
Ward of Bones
Winter Orb

Lands:
Academy Ruins
Ancient Tomb
Blinkmoth Nexus
City of Traitors
Crystal Vein
Darksteel Citadel
Dread Statuary
Gargoyle Castle
Hall of the Bandit Lord
16x Island
Maze of Ith
Minamo, School at Water's Edge
Mishra's Factory
Saprazzan Skerry
Seat of the Synod
Stalking Stones
Strip Mine
Svyelunite Temple
Terrain Generator
Tolaria West
Urza's Factory
Wasteland

For those of you who don't know what Arcum Dagsson does, he reads: 
{3} {U}
Legendary Creature - Human Artificer
 {Tap}:Target artifact creature's controller sacrifices it. That player may search his or her library for a noncreature artifact card, put it into play, then shuffle his or her library
2/2

So the plan of the deck is to get Arcum out there as early as possible and start sacrificing some artifact creatures and get lock pieces out there. Once a lock is established (if everyone doesn't concede or I don't back out) I can Just wait till I find a decent win condition.

The locks in the deck are:
Ward of Bones - If I can get a turn 1 or 2 Arcum, searching up Ward of Bones means that everyone else gets 1 more land than I do. Of course, a bunch of my lands add more than 1 mana or can be sacrificed, locking opponents at 2 or 3 lands, which makes it hard to get out of the lock or try to find an answer. By the time they do, I'll probably have found Darksteel Forge to keep the land count low.

Mycosynth Lattice + Kill Switch - Everyone can play lands, but what's the point if they're always going to be tapped as long as I remember to leave 2 mana open at the end of my turn?

Mycosynth Lattice + Darksteel Forge + Nevinyrral's Disk - Blow up the world every turn and leave my board hanging around? Sure, why not?

Mycosynth Lattice + March of the Machines - if the hand is broken enough, this can come down as early as turn 2, though that requires a lot of luck. This leaves everyone with no lands, but me with at least a 4/4 Enchantment Artifact Creature and a 6/6 Artifact Creature. Sounds good to me.

Mindslaver + Academy Ruins - Classic steal someones turn forever. Throw in Rings of Brighthearth to steal turns from 2 people.

With 5 lands that can produce 2 mana and 11 pieces of cheap artifact acceleration, Arcum can come down on turns 2 or 3 consistently, with the possibility of the occasional turn 1.

The deck doesn't have much draw in it as I felt that my general is a tutor himself and I'd rather tutor for am answer rather than try to draw one.

In case something happens to Arcum such as an early Pithing Needle, I have alternate ways to win, tutor and cheat artifacts into play.

Master Transmuter allows me to cheat large casting cost artifacts into play for the small cost of switching an artifact out of play. She also plays really nice with Monoliths and cards with CiP effects like Faerie Mechanist, Solemn Simulacrum and Sundering Titan.

The alternate win* creatures are Karn to animate artifacts to beat with and Master of Etherium or Steel Overseer to make the other artifact creatures and themselves bigger to beat in with

The alternate tutors in the deck are Transmute Artifact, Reshape, Fabricate and Tezzeret. Since Tinker is banned, I'm using most, if not all the Tinker-like effects I can and Tezzeret is a win condition also by turning all my artifacts into 5/5 beaters (as if people didn't know that on a Vintage forum).

Probably in this whole list, the only card that I don't think works as well as I hoped is Winter Orb. It may slow other people down, but once everyone else starts getting artifact acceleration out there, it's really not as good as it could be.


*Yes, I do realize I said swinging with creatures is an alternate win. Remember when swinging with creatures was the original win? Man, times have changed.
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Anusien
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« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2010, 03:35:23 pm »

You know EDH is supposed to be about fun, right?
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AmbivalentDuck
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« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2010, 04:38:21 pm »

Your general doesn't have haste.  The minute he's revealed, everyone at the table will hold targeted removal just for him.  Misdirection seems strong in that context.

If you're going to be an ass, you'll need blockers and board disruption.  Consider Shield Sphere and Tangle Wire.  Also, I'd run Bribery "just because."

You know EDH is supposed to be about fun, right?
He wouldn't be the first person I've met who thinks that being the first down means you have the "best" deck.  We had one guy at our monthly EDH meetup who considered it a badge of honor.
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« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2010, 08:30:33 pm »

You know EDH is supposed to be about fun, right?

isnt fun in the eye of the beholder/the eyes of the group?

also, Mycosynth Lattice + karn + tezz is a three card combo
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Sporkcore
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« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2010, 10:00:39 am »

@Anusien: The store I play at has weekly EDH tournaments, so it is very competitive.

@Ambivalentduck: I do tend to have the best deck at the table. Having won or placed with Azami and Rofellos in the past along with Kozilek as my general before Karn (I stopped using him when I got a turn 2 Sundering Titan followed by a turn 3 Kozilek). People targeted me when I was playing Karn constantly. I had someone drop a Sorren Markov, put me at 10, then drop an Emerakul and attack me even though I had no hand and only lands out because he was afraid that I would be able to "go off" when someone else had a Felidar Sovereign out that the next person had to deal with.

People at that store just happen to use more creature based decks when I like using combos. I wouldn't try to be such a D bag when playing, but if there's prize involved, I'm going to pull out a competitive deck. Before I sold most of my cards, I had a group chaos Tibor and Lumia deck and a fun Kiki-Jiki deck also which I would play in casual games.

I didn't think about Tangle Wire, that will definably go in over the Winter Orb. I'm personally not a fan of Bribery so I'm not going to run it. MisD and Shield Sphere are options, but I wouldn't know what to cut for those.
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AmbivalentDuck
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« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2010, 11:34:14 am »

@Anusien: The store I play at has weekly EDH tournaments, so it is very competitive.
Sounds like not enough of the final ranking is based on sportsmanship.

Quote
@Ambivalentduck: I do tend to have the best deck at the table. Having won or placed with Azami and Rofellos in the past along with Kozilek as my general before Karn (I stopped using him when I got a turn 2 Sundering Titan followed by a turn 3 Kozilek). People targeted me when I was playing Karn constantly.
Another way to say it is that your general gives so much information about your deck that everybody knows exactly what to target.  One guy claimed that I was "targeting him" because I nailed his fourth turn Captain Sisay (his general, which his deck was highly dependent on) with a Swords to Plowshares.  In that same game, I had my general killed twice, had someone fully expose themselves to take me down to Banefire range, and was attacked every turn by a Grave Titan.  I can't say that anyone was targeting me: they were just making the best choices based on board position.
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« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2010, 11:42:08 am »

If you don't want EDH to be "competitive," just ban all cards that allow you to tutor.  That's the plan at one of my local shops.  Other than that, game on.  You really want to try a combo deck in a large multiplayer match?  As long as everyone else isn't stupid, that should go over like a lead balloon.  Everytime someone uses Zur, Sisay, or similar combo generals, the rest of the board just nukes that player first. 
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Sporkcore
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« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2010, 12:18:02 pm »

Quote
@Ambivalentduck: I do tend to have the best deck at the table. Having won or placed with Azami and Rofellos in the past along with Kozilek as my general before Karn (I stopped using him when I got a turn 2 Sundering Titan followed by a turn 3 Kozilek). People targeted me when I was playing Karn constantly.
Another way to say it is that your general gives so much information about your deck that everybody knows exactly what to target.  One guy claimed that I was "targeting him" because I nailed his fourth turn Captain Sisay (his general, which his deck was highly dependent on) with a Swords to Plowshares.  In that same game, I had my general killed twice, had someone fully expose themselves to take me down to Banefire range, and was attacked every turn by a Grave Titan.  I can't say that anyone was targeting me: they were just making the best choices based on board position.

I wish the people who played in the tournaments would think that way. When I was attacked by the Emerakul, I only had lands, a Thran Dynamo and a scroll rack out with no hand since the board was Austere Commanded and Akroma's Vengenced away. I was no threat. In another game, the Multani player chose to keep attacking me even though the  Rosheen Meanderer player was building up a huge mana base to win.

One person who plays in the tournaments said he goes for me first because I used to use Roffelos, so I do like to believe I'm being targeted.

Personally, if I'm going after someone, it's because of their general or board state. But lately, I've been trying to go for combos or cards that lock out the whole board so no one feels like I'm going after them in particular.

Other than a mono green deck or 2, most of the generals that get played around here are Blue or Blue based with an occasional Teneb. Most of the games come down to who combos out first or who gets out a Felidar Sovereign and can keep it till their next turn. There's not a lot of spot removal, mostly Wrath effects and steal effects. Even when I played Rofellos, I would go for one of the infinite mana combos and find a way to play out my deck and attack that turn because of Concordant Crossroads. When that got boring, I switched to a slower green general like Azusa or Sasaya which were more fun to play against since they were both beat down decks.
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« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2010, 07:12:24 am »

In another game, the Multani player chose to keep attacking me even though the  Rosheen Meanderer player was building up a huge mana base to win.

Actually i was playing Rhys the Redeemed at the time, if i am recalling the same time you were talking about (i do often play Multani too, so you might misremember).  I know this because i won that game with Mirror Entity pumped Mirrari's Wake fueled Sacred Mesa Pegasus'.

It worked out better to take you out, because in that game, had you cast Emrakul, Jesse and I probably lose, seeing as to how i was the biggest threat, and with you endlessly time walking, even had Jesse Squared canceled him.  Max's Rosheen was much easier to neutralize via counter magic.  The only threat was him casting Banefire, which i can't recall if he just didn't have in hand or had already used at that point.  Either way, taking you out removed the largest potential threat to which Jesse and I had no answers.  He knew he was dead on board to you (because he can't counter Emrakul) and i knew i was dead on board to Max (because i had no counter magic).  I took out his threat and he neutralized mine (when he canceled the Ice Cauldroned Fireball, aimed at me), it wasn't my fault he has dead on board to me too,  Wink

That is, if that is the time you are talking about.  If not, well, my bad.
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Sporkcore
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« Reply #9 on: December 10, 2010, 11:59:50 pm »

In another game, the Multani player chose to keep attacking me even though the  Rosheen Meanderer player was building up a huge mana base to win.

Actually i was playing Rhys the Redeemed at the time, if i am recalling the same time you were talking about (i do often play Multani too, so you might misremember).  I know this because i won that game with Mirror Entity pumped Mirrari's Wake fueled Sacred Mesa Pegasus'.

It worked out better to take you out, because in that game, had you cast Emrakul, Jesse and I probably lose, seeing as to how i was the biggest threat, and with you endlessly time walking, even had Jesse Squared canceled him.  Max's Rosheen was much easier to neutralize via counter magic.  The only threat was him casting Banefire, which i can't recall if he just didn't have in hand or had already used at that point.  Either way, taking you out removed the largest potential threat to which Jesse and I had no answers.  He knew he was dead on board to you (because he can't counter Emrakul) and i knew i was dead on board to Max (because i had no counter magic).  I took out his threat and he neutralized mine (when he canceled the Ice Cauldroned Fireball, aimed at me), it wasn't my fault he has dead on board to me too,  Wink

That is, if that is the time you are talking about.  If not, well, my bad.

It was actually just a game between Max, Greg and myself.
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« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2010, 02:11:37 am »

to be fair playing vs ed goodwin and the rest of the sheer amazing caliber of players at the depot on the regular on sundays, they get scared when you go squire pass turn
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« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2010, 01:57:24 pm »

It was actually just a game between Max, Greg and myself.

Well, in that case, nevermind,  Very Happy
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« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2010, 12:33:40 am »

If you don't want EDH to be "competitive," just ban all cards that allow you to tutor.  That's the plan at one of my local shops.  Other than that, game on.  You really want to try a combo deck in a large multiplayer match?  As long as everyone else isn't stupid, that should go over like a lead balloon.  Everytime someone uses Zur, Sisay, or similar combo generals, the rest of the board just nukes that player first. 

I think this is a poor blanket rule; while you might be right when it comes to offensive tutors, cast for the sole purpose of comboing out, you essentially kill toolbox control decks, which a great foil for combo decks.  Slow control decks like this can be fun but not abusive in this format.  It's my favorite type of deck to play.  A good aggro deck is very difficult to build in multiplayer, and combo is usually unsocial.
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