5C Stax - A Forgotten Diamond or a Hopeless Dream?

[TurnOneTSphere]

I agree with Prospero about the match up against Marinara Mud, although it may be a slightly worse match up than that. I have tested against a couple of different welder decks with 5C and it is a nightmare.
It is hard to keep relevant artifacts on the board if they get a welder out. 

Although I do believe that 5C can make a come back after seeing it dominate in both testing and in person at GenCon.

[Magnus76]

I ran my original list at BoM against 7 MUD-variants, winning 6 and loosing one. I have never felt facing a Workshop-deck with 5c to be a nightmare, this is actually my favorite match-up. Take out their artifacts you are really loosing against (Crucible, Lodestone) and time is on your side. Your draws are better and your ability to obtain control is better because of all artifact hate. SoR is not bad preboard in the Workshop-matchup since it, combined with Crucible, will seal the game for you. The spheres are though naturally boarded out because the board contains better options.

This deck has much worse problems against Dredge and Dark Confidant. It is not that it can not win, it is just the randomness that does not feel comfortable to me. Land-mox-Confidant is, to me, the most feared enemy opening, to which I do not have any quick answers (tutor for Balance or resolving Trike being the only relevant). If I do not get a solution to Confidant, I am likely to loose the match. This is a quite different story if you are running a Workshop variant with Lodestones since you are then racing for life totals and Confidant must not be dealt with at the same necessity. Confidant will in the end probably serve as a blocker and, by that time, has likely also hurt your enemy (which is your target). I am thinking about a Pyroclasm in the board against Bob.dec (also Snapcasters and Clique are neutralized) and also Fish (mainly to take out Noble Hierarch).

Dredge is often a match-up where I loose the first game, win the second on the play and loose the third on the draw. It is not 100 % but it is the most likely scenario. What I do not like in G3 is the mull-to-Leyline strategy since it will likely cost me some mulliganing and enemy will play land-bounce/hate anyway on the play. Spheres do not help here, they are just too slow. With Tormod/Nihil Spellbomb I can instead play it on the draw with a sphere-backup. The Welders increase quite a bit in strength with artifacts as graveyard hate. Has anyone tested the Dredge-matchup thoroughly? 4 Leylines + 1 Tormod vs. 5 mixed artifacts?

I am thinking of the new artifact that turns your lands to rainbow lands, any thoughts on this one? I think I like it over Mox Opal since Opal often does nothing amazing, but this artifact can really get you on line again in many common situations (i.e. you control a sphere, a Workshop and a singleton rainbow land and want to cast multicolored spells.)

[rukcus]

I think Chromatic Lantern is enough to push 5C Stax back into consideration. It serves an important accelerator that works well with Spheres and gives us the ability to start using Workshops for casting spells too. Mox Opal as you mentioned, has a low impact on the board development and is finnicky to activate Metalcraft when you're trying to have a fast start. It also combines better with Karn Silver Golem in giving the deck additional beaters.

[Bibendum]

With lanterns printing, did anyone try and look at baleful strix as a one of in this list? Its synergy with welder is obvious, the double cost issue can be fixed by lantern and its also not difficult to cast on its own and it trades positively with almost every single beater in the format. I know it might be entering too cute status but I was wondering what some of the people more familiar with the deck then I was thought.

[Bibendum]

So after looking at the lists posted here and testing on my own/playing a few events I think if I were to take 5c somewhere right now this is the list I would run with:

4 Workshop
4 Wasteland
3 City of Brass
3 Gemstone Mine
1 Cavern Of Souls
1 Tolarian Academy
1 Bazaar
1 Strip Mine
1 Barbarian Ring

5 Mox
1 Lotus
1 Crypt
1 Mox Opal
1 Chromatic Lantern
1 Sol ring

4 Goblin Welder
1 Duplicant
1 Triskelion
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Gorilla Shaman
1 Sundering Titan
1 Sylvok Replica
1 Phyrexian Metamorph

4 Sphere of Resistance
4 Tangle Wire
3 Smokestack
2 Crucible of worlds
1 Trinisphere

1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric tutor
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Tinker
1 Crop Rotation
1 Dreadbore
1 Ancient Grudge

Sideboard
4 LLOTV
4 Graffdigers Cage
2 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Sylvok Replica
2 Choke
1 Helm of Obediance


I feel that the list is fairly standard for 5c but I will say there are a few choices I need to explain.

1. The manabase: While i feel it is fairly standard, I think the big change is cutting Mana Vault for Chromatic Lantern. Other then that there is no real change or innovation in the mana base.

2. No Balance. Balance might be my favorite card ever printed outside of Goblin welder but the last two event's I played in, I felt that it was not packing the punch I wanted it too. It was rather underwhelming in most blue matchups as I felt I was removing a card or two from there hand at the trade off a welder or a few lands. If you were to argue with me of why Balance should be included I would not say you were wrong, I just think its sub-optimal at the moment.

3. Dreadbore. I know this is the one that most people will have an issue with. Outside of losing to dredge the only times I have lost on 5c was to a resolved Jace that I could not answer. With two Tutors, Bazaar and a Singleton copy you can dig to find this more often then you might think and it can be such a beating when resolved. On top of the Jace this is a removal spell for Bob. While not the easiest thing to cast vs. Shops it is still a card that can be cast and can have a great effect on the board.

4. The sideboard options: The dredge package is massive. I felt that was a match-up I lost multiple times when I did not want too and this fixes that problem. 10 cards is a bit much, but Spellbomb and Cage can double as hate for other match-ups. Replica's are amazing for oath/shops and the recursion with Welder can be a huge boon. Choke, Choke is a card that shines because I feel most blue decks don't pack as many Claims compared to Grudges these days. Gush is existent but most of the prevalent blue decks like Bomberman or Standstill are hurt pretty immensely by this. The one helm is just because with leyline its an auto win and It doesn't even need to resolve with a Welder on the board. 2 Tutors, a Tinker and Bazaar will again allow you to find this card more often then expected for a one of.

Notable exceptions:
1. Memory Jar- Mem Jar is one of my favorite cards again but I feel there is just no room for it. Blue has changed and Jar is not what it used too be.
2. Lodestone- I feel this is not exactly a card that should be in a 5c list as it does not have synergy with 80% of the deck.
3. Karn- Karn is a card that I think shines in traditional shop builds more then in 5c. That being said, if I was not playing mox monkey I think I would have Karn in the deck. I still debate making him a one of.
4. Chains - Chains is amazing. If choke doesn't work I will be back to 1 chains and 1 more Grudge or Replica. I just feel choke can hurt much more then chains can in a vacuum but chains is another card that if I was allowed a few extra sideboard cards, it would be right there.

This is my thoughts on the list. As always any input is very welcome since I am by no means a master of 5c. I just think it is the most entertaining shop variant to play due to its different nature. Hey, even as a shop pilot, casting recall/tinker every now and again is a lot of fun .