Dragon's Maze

[DubDub]

My informal Dragon's Maze set review.

Scale
[Not Mentioned] - Unplayable
1 - Possibly playable in conjunction with yet-to-be-printed card(s)
2 - Possibly playable in conjunction with existing cards
3 - Will consistently be played, but not produce metagame shift
4 - Format all-star, will shift metagame or create new archetype
5 - Will warp format, shift metagame, verge on or merit restriction or push something else to restriction.

White 
1
Wake the Reflections

Blue 
2
Hidden Strings

Black 

Red 

Green 

Multicolor
2
Notion Thief
Ral Zarek
Valrolz, the Scar Striped - Could possibly provide a slight boost or reawaken interest in Phyrexian Dreadnaught
Voice of Resurgence

Split Cards
1
Give//Take - Basically, for Take: imagine if they printed a -10/-10 creature that entered the battlefield with 11 +1/+1 counters on it for , this could possibly be playable in conjunction with such a card.
2
Far//Away
Wear//Tear

Artifacts

Lands

In total, two 1's and seven 2's is dismal.  Very sad set for Vintage.

[gkraigher]

blood scrivener is without question a 1.  But yeah, this set has been weak.  We said the same thing about the last set though, before we realized those two hermit druids were a new archetype.  Albeit, an inconsistent one. 

[DubDub]

blood scrivener is without question a 1.  But yeah, this set has been weak.  We said the same thing about the last set though, before we realized those two hermit druids were a new archetype.  Albeit, an inconsistent one. 

I'm afraid I disagree.  Even in the case where a cheap, powerful enabler emerges that makes it common to have an empty hand and to be drawing cards, it's still a Phyrexian Arena/Bob.  What's the best case scenario involving Scrivener and any realistic made-up card?  Drawing three extra cards and losing three life?  I'd basically rather be chaining Night's Whisper versus two-card-combo'ing for free Ambition's Costs.

[Saya]

How about new spider?

[DubDub]

How about new spider?

Assuming this means the 2/2 with four positive abilities for  ?  It's good against Jace, Clique, Delver, but doing nothing against Dredge, Shops (can be played through a chalice@2!), Oath, Tarmogoyf, Tinker, etc means it won't make an impact.  I don't think it will be played, and were it to be played, I don't think the likely level of play to merit mentioning.

However, following this trend of drastically increasing the power level of creatures, we'll soon be getting 4/4's for  with seven positive abilities.  Then I'll start getting excited.

[MaximumCDawg]

In concur, this set is pretty weak.  I liked Gatecrash better- it provided us with lots of potential combo opportunities, even if no one used em.  (Duskmantle Guildmage + Mindcrank, etc).

Your list is spot-on, but you might want to add Beck // Call as a 2.  I don't know why you'd run this over Skullclamp in Elves, but it is a possibility for breaking out of a Chalice at 1 in some bizarre list.  Worth looking at.

How about new spider?

Assuming this means the 2/2 with four positive abilities for   ?  It's good against Jace, Clique, Delver, but doing nothing against Dredge, Shops (can be played through a chalice@2!), Oath, Tarmogoyf, Tinker, etc means it won't make an impact.  I don't think it will be played, and were it to be played, I don't think the likely level of play to merit mentioning.

Yeah, this is a wonderful little answer dude for Delver of Secrets, but Vintage isn't really demanding such a card.  He's nice to have around just in case his ability becomes super relevant.  Like, if everyone goes back to Inkwell Levithan from Blightsteel (not gonna happen).

[DubDub]

Your list is spot-on, but you might want to add Beck // Call as a 2.  I don't know why you'd run this over Skullclamp in Elves, but it is a possibility for breaking out of a Chalice at 1 in some bizarre list.  Worth looking at.

Re: Spider
Yeah, this is a wonderful little answer dude for Delver of Secrets, but Vintage isn't really demanding such a card.  He's nice to have around just in case his ability becomes super relevant.  Like, if everyone goes back to Inkwell Levithan from Blightsteel (not gonna happen).

You could be right about Beck//Call, but I have my doubts.  Elves is pretty fringe, and that's a pretty fringe card for them... fringe^2 = not worth mentioning.  (If a new card was going to vault Elves to metagame-staple, then it'd be listed higher than 2.)

Inkwell has Islandwalk, so if it's not unblockable you're probably doing something wrong.  It also has trample, so throwing a 2/2 in the way doesn't gain much.

[Wagner]

In concur, this set is pretty weak.  I liked Gatecrash better- it provided us with lots of potential combo opportunities, even if no one used em.  (Duskmantle Guildmage + Mindcrank, etc).

Your list is spot-on, but you might want to add Beck // Call as a 2.  I don't know why you'd run this over Skullclamp in Elves, but it is a possibility for breaking out of a Chalice at 1 in some bizarre list.  Worth looking at.

How about new spider?

Assuming this means the 2/2 with four positive abilities for   ?  It's good against Jace, Clique, Delver, but doing nothing against Dredge, Shops (can be played through a chalice@2!), Oath, Tarmogoyf, Tinker, etc means it won't make an impact.  I don't think it will be played, and were it to be played, I don't think the likely level of play to merit mentioning.

Yeah, this is a wonderful little answer dude for Delver of Secrets, but Vintage isn't really demanding such a card.  He's nice to have around just in case his ability becomes super relevant.  Like, if everyone goes back to Inkwell Levithan from Blightsteel (not gonna happen).

I still don'T see the appeal of the green dude at all. Sure, it blocks stuff and can't be countered, but it's still going to only trade with Delver, Snapcaster, Clique and whatever else, 1 for 1 in the best scenario, hardly impressive. I think I'd rather have the 2/1 reach and deathtouch spider instead in a lot of scenarios.

[MaximumCDawg]

New spider has pro blue, so it blocks inky like a champ and cannot be bounced.  Thornweald archer is more like removal, and you still take trample.

[Cthulhu1975]

New spider has pro blue, so it blocks inky like a champ and cannot be bounced.  Thornweald archer is more like removal, and you still take trample.

Although Inkwell will trample over this little fellow as well.

[MaximumCDawg]

New spider has pro blue, so it blocks inky like a champ and cannot be bounced.  Thornweald archer is more like removal, and you still take trample.

Although Inkwell will trample over this little fellow as well.

Why?  Damage dealt to a creature with protection from that color is reduced to zero, I thought.

EDIT: Looked it up.  What a crock.  I'm not sure why the damage rules are now written that way.  If you normally cannot assign enough damage to kill the defending creature, you gotta assign all of it to the creature.  Deathtouch permits you to assign only 1 damage; why doesn't protection force you to assign all of it?

Even more stupid, does this mean a creature with trample+deathtouch will always trample everything but 1 of its power over a defender with protection, regardless of the defenders toughness?

[Cthulhu1975]

New spider has pro blue, so it blocks inky like a champ and cannot be bounced.  Thornweald archer is more like removal, and you still take trample.

Although Inkwell will trample over this little fellow as well.

Why?  Damage dealt to a creature with protection from that color is reduced to zero, I thought.

As I understand it you have to assign lethal to the blocker (2 damage) and the rest is trampled over to the player. Then the spider will not die due to protection. So you would still take 5.

[evouga]

blood scrivener is without question a 1.  But yeah, this set has been weak.  We said the same thing about the last set though, before we realized those two hermit druids were a new archetype.  Albeit, an inconsistent one. 

I'm afraid I disagree.  Even in the case where a cheap, powerful enabler emerges that makes it common to have an empty hand and to be drawing cards, it's still a Phyrexian Arena/Bob.  What's the best case scenario involving Scrivener and any realistic made-up card?  Drawing three extra cards and losing three life?  I'd basically rather be chaining Night's Whisper versus two-card-combo'ing for free Ambition's Costs.

The key to abusing Scrivener will be invoking his ability many times per turn. Think cycling, Stars/Spheres, or future cards with abilities like "Discard two cards: draw a card."

[DubDub]

blood scrivener is without question a 1.  But yeah, this set has been weak.  We said the same thing about the last set though, before we realized those two hermit druids were a new archetype.  Albeit, an inconsistent one. 

I'm afraid I disagree.  Even in the case where a cheap, powerful enabler emerges that makes it common to have an empty hand and to be drawing cards, it's still a Phyrexian Arena/Bob.  What's the best case scenario involving Scrivener and any realistic made-up card?  Drawing three extra cards and losing three life?  I'd basically rather be chaining Night's Whisper versus two-card-combo'ing for free Ambition's Costs.

The key to abusing Scrivener will be invoking his ability many times per turn. Think cycling, Stars/Spheres, or future cards with abilities like "Discard two cards: draw a card."

And emptying your hand in between each time?  Fluctuator is a better enabler for cycling (and if cycling costs zero, why would you pay a life for an extra card instead of just doing it again?).  A card saying "Discard two cards: draw a card." will not exist, because of Dredge.

I already accounted for this anyway, when I talked about drawing three extra cards and losing three life, see the bolded text above.

I mean, all power to the person that gets this, Arcanis the Omnipotent, Zombie Infestation and Intruder Alarm into play at the same time, but I'll stick to more compact combos.

[Guli]

How about new spider?

Scryb Ranger is better, but the spider is not super bad or anything.

[credmond]

Scrivener is definitely worth mentioning. Just because it works around hellbent doesn't mean its jank. The most potent hellbent deck worth noting is Uba bazaar stax and scrivener fits right in to a BR version of that deck and gives it a serious boost in power level. No need for elaborate combos.

[DubDub]

Scrivener is definitely worth mentioning. Just because it works around hellbent doesn't mean its jank. The most potent hellbent deck worth noting is Uba bazaar stax and scrivener fits right in to a BR version of that deck and gives it a serious boost in power level. No need for elaborate combos.

Do you really think Uba Stax is coming back with this card?  How can it compete with mono-brown Workshop aggro?  Uba Stax with Scrivener STILL seems like doing something elaborate.  The key for Uba is to have: 2 Goblin Welders, and an Uba Mask (plus an artifact in the graveyard).  You weld Uba Mask in and out during the opponent's upkeep and drawstep to 'trap' their newly drawn card in exile.

What's gained from adding Scrivener to that?  Drawing an extra card each turn?  If your lock is operating correctly you don't need to draw cards quickly (and certainly not at the cost of life), because there's nothing the opponent can do.

[gkraigher]

DubDub, it's gotten to a point on scrivener where it's damned if you do and damned if you don't.  Every point that you've made about him is valid, and it's certainly not playable right now.  But this has happened before, namely dark depths, where you would look at that card and think it's completely worthless until they print some other card that interacts very well with it.  I don't know what that card is yet for scrivener, but I do think there could be something.  It's extremely cast-able, draws cards, and is a zombie and a wizard.  

I don't think you are objectively evaluating the future potential of the card, and you are letting your bias influence your opinion.  

And by the way, Dark Confidant is a staple of vintage.  Where you are paying the average CC in your deck to draw a card, which is usually something a little over 1.  So, yes, scriveners draw 3 for 3 life is a great deal.  It's better than ancient craving and night's whispers because you get a permanent along with any card drawing.  

Here's a card they could print:  BB - sorcery - exile any number of cards in your hand, target player exiles x cards in his or her hand. 

[Wagner]

New spider has pro blue, so it blocks inky like a champ and cannot be bounced.  Thornweald archer is more like removal, and you still take trample.

Although Inkwell will trample over this little fellow as well.

Why?  Damage dealt to a creature with protection from that color is reduced to zero, I thought.

EDIT: Looked it up.  What a crock.  I'm not sure why the damage rules are now written that way.  If you normally cannot assign enough damage to kill the defending creature, you gotta assign all of it to the creature.  Deathtouch permits you to assign only 1 damage; why doesn't protection force you to assign all of it?

Even more stupid, does this mean a creature with trample+deathtouch will always trample everything but 1 of its power over a defender with protection, regardless of the defenders toughness?

Pretty sure this is the way trample always worked, the new damage thing has nothing to do here. You assign lethal, then trample over.

[DubDub]

DubDub, it's gotten to a point on scrivener where it's damned if you do and damned if you don't.  Every point that you've made about him is valid, and it's certainly not playable right now.  But this has happened before, namely dark depths, where you would look at that card and think it's completely worthless until they print some other card that interacts very well with it.  I don't know what that card is yet for scrivener, but I do think there could be something.  It's extremely cast-able, draws cards, and is a zombie and a wizard.  

I don't think you are objectively evaluating the future potential of the card, and you are letting your bias influence your opinion.  

And by the way, Dark Confidant is a staple of vintage.  Where you are paying the average CC in your deck to draw a card, which is usually something a little over 1.  So, yes, scriveners draw 3 for 3 life is a great deal.  It's better than ancient craving and night's whispers because you get a permanent along with any card drawing.  

Here's a card they could print:  BB - sorcery - exile any number of cards in your hand, target player exiles x cards in his or her hand. 

Regarding Dark Depths: Marit Lage is a 20/20 indestructible, flying dude stapled to a land (i.e. not counterable).  I'd say the upside was always quite a bit greater with Dark Depths than with Scrivener.

Regarding BB+exile for exile-twist: That card won't get printed.  I said somewhere above that enablers that see a reasonable chance of printing don't make for a compelling case.  Sure, your proposed card is a worthwhile reason to become hellbent, but even once you're hellbent I'm not convinced Scrivener is what you'd want.  The hand-emptying effect has to be repeatable in order to gain value, and it's really hard to attach a benefit to that cost that makes it worthwhile.  "Discard two cards: draw a card" is out because of dredge.  So... "exile two cards: draw a card"?  What does that give?  Recursion-free, but cost-free, looting (really, costing a life each time)?  So what, the two cards you draw are the two you have to pay the cost with if you want to repeat.

Regarding Dark Confidant: The condition for Dark Confidant to trigger is "at the beginning of your upkeep".  For Scrivener it's "if you would draw a card and have no cards in hand".  It seems pretty clear to me why one is a format all-star and the other didn't merit mentioning (in my opinion).  I have an upkeep every turn, free of charge!  Fundamentally, jumping through hoops in order to draw extra cards, when one of the hoops is "empty your hand" doesn't seem like something I'd want to be doing.

[brianpk80]

Pretty accurate overall.
I'd give a 2 to the Green Insect which has uses that haven't been pointed out yet.  
Sin Collector is also playable and may become a sideboard mainstay in Humans.

Blood Scrivener can make the list with a 1-2, but it has a lot of the problems you pointed out.  It seems like it should be good but attempting to capitalize on it gets clumsy.  Maybe a future printing/mechanic could help.    

I'd rank DGM over Gatecrash for Vintage contributions, but a lot of the set is drastically underpowered.  I saw a counterspell in the spoiler that read "3U - Counter target spell unless its controller pays ."  Just abysmal.  Most of the Champions could have or taken off their CC and still not be competitive.  They're getting into Homelands/Mirage/Masques territory with how inefficient the cards are.  Power creep must run in cycles.  

RtR earns a nomination for worst Vintage block of all time.  It has only three staples (RiP, Shaman, Decay) and everything else is unplayable except for the few cards that have fringe uses only.  

[xouman]

I would add:

2 - Deputy of Acquittals. Fringe playable.
2 - Sin collector. Fringe playable.
1 - Trostani's Summoner. I agree that Flash should win the game faster, but this card with Flash puts into battlefield a 2/2, 3/3 and 4/4 for 1U, undependant from grave

best card for vintage should be the thief. I will put it as 3 instead of 2. Seems really playable in lots of metagames. If gush is seeing more play because of regrowth unrestriction, thief only gets better.

[DubDub]

As seen on TheSource:



LEAD DESIGNER // DEVELOPER
Return to Ravnica - Ken Nagel // Eric Lauer
Gatecrash - MaRo + MaGo // Dave Humphreys
Dragon's Maze - Alexis Janson // Zac Hill

Guess I'll wait for the next Nagel // Lauer production.  :-\

[boggyb]

Eh, I think RTR was mostly designed with limited in mind. A lot of people have said they're jazz-handsing over it at the draft table. I just don't like draft, very much, but good for them. We'll get em next time.

[Kirika]

Notion Thief the mugger of Jace sounds pretty good to play one via Cavern of Souls on Human in response to your opponents using Jace's Brainstorm ability.  They better have a Lightning Bolt, Izzet Charm or Swords to Plowshares.   You then have a 3/1 to smash Jace with next turn too assuming your opponent didn't Fate seal first.   Is pretty good versus Ancestral Recall, Brainstorm, Gush, Yawgmoth's Bargain as well.   Only caveats are costing 4 mana and being bad versus Workshops and Fish.   Probably worth at least trying running 1 Notion Thief sideboard for control mirrors if you have Cavern of Souls in your deck.   

I want to like Ral Zarek because he untaps Timevault but Jace Brainstorm, Unsummon and Fate seal are much better then Ral Zarek, untap timevault and  lightning bolt.   Ral Zarek ultimate sounds fun though.  Both Tezerrets are probably better then Ral Zarek making 5/5's or finding Time Vault.

[Meddling Mike]

I thought Down // Dirty was interesting. Dirty is pretty close to a Regrowth and it has the flexibility to do other things. The fact that it's   instead of   like Regrowth might be the back breaker, but I thought the fact that you can randomly turn it into a discard spell or possibly do both if you have the mana lying around might put it into the realm of discussion

[Wagner]

Recollect already exists. Not an awful card, but seems way too expansive for what it does.

How does Fuze work with counterspells? Do they need to counter both?

[DubDub]

How does Fuze work with counterspells? Do they need to counter both?

No.  'Both halves' of the spell can be fuzed, but the one card physically on the stack represents the resulting spell cast, whether that was Far, Away or Far AND Away, etc.

Interestingly, Red Elemental blast can counter Far or Far AND Away, but cannot counter Away alone.

[msg67183]

I think Ruric Thar is a possible Dread Return target if decks like Burning Long become more popular.

Crypt Incursion seems cute against Dredge if you can get 3 mana fast.

Master of Cruelties seems like somehow it could get played with some sort of burn.

Sire of Insanity with Reanimate and Entomb seems pretty good.

[Protoaddict]

I think skylasher is way more viable than people think. 2 power + reach is very good, and he beats counterwars. He may only be a sideboard option against delver but that deck has the potential to hit that type of status and relevance and this keeps it in check. Also just good in a Jace war.

Also does anyone see anything to armed // dangerous? If only for Armed? It seems rather cheap to make something that lethal. I can easily imagine you one shotting something with a 5-6 power goyf very out of nowhere, especially with exalted triggers. Maybe its too narrow but its just such a strong pump.