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Author Topic: [Free Podcast] SMIP: Journey into Nyx Vintage Set Review  (Read 6772 times)
Smmenen
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« on: May 07, 2014, 07:09:06 pm »

http://www.eternalcentral.com/so-many-insane-plays-podcast-episode-35-journey-into-nyx/

Kevin Cron and Steve Menendian review Journey into Nyx and grade their Born of the Gods report card.


Podcast (somanyinsaneplays): Download (Duration: 2:20:14 — 102.3MB)


Timestamped Table of Contents:
0:01:00: Announcements: Banned and Restricted List Updates, or lack thereof.
0:04:40: Born of the Gods Report Card
0:11:15: Aegis of the Gods
0:26:29: Mana Confluence
0:36:28: Dakra Mystic
0:48:06: Prophetic Flamespeaker
0:58:37: Eidolon of the Great Revel
1:09:37: Oppressive Rays
1:12:25: Athreos, God of Passage
1:18:34: Dictate of Kruphix
1:20:36: Spite of Mogis
1:23:32: Eidolon of Rhetoric
1:28:20: King Macar, the Gold-Cursed
1:33:05: Pull from the Deep
1:36:32: Disciple of Deceit
1:50:09: Summary
1:53:14: Dack Fayden
Other Show Notes

- Journey Into Nyx Visual Spoiler
- Eudomonia 93/94 Old School Magic May 18 (Berkeley, CA, USA)
- Team Serious Open Vintage May 31 (Columbus, OH, USA)
- Forgotten Path Games Vintage June 8 (Vacaville, CA, USA)
- Team Serious Open Vintage June 14 (Columbus, OH, USA)

Contact us at @ManyInsanePlays on Twitter or e-mail us at SoManyInsanePlaysPodcast@gmail.com.



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sfielder001
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« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2014, 10:03:44 pm »

Another advantage that Aegis of the Gods has over True Believer that should be noted is that you can target yourself with Ancestral Recall with Aegis in play, but not True Believer.  Making 4-color humans another option as well as junk.
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« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2014, 07:07:15 am »

The ultimate for Dack is not particularly synergistic, I agree, but there are a few cards. Using fire/ice to steal two creatures or ice to steal a Jace, pyroblast to steal anything, or darkblast to steal creatures are all cards I might play without Dack.

Marc
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« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2014, 09:39:53 am »

Another great show, guys.

Inspired Flamespeaker's ability first appeared on Elkin Bottle back in Ice Age. We first put it on a red card in Magic 2014 with Chandra, Pyromaster.
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« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2014, 11:21:12 am »

Another great show, guys.

Inspired Flamespeaker's ability first appeared on Elkin Bottle back in Ice Age. We first put it on a red card in Magic 2014 with Chandra, Pyromaster.

Er, what about Elkin Lair?

EDIT: I guess that card is a little different, since it sends a card from your hand into exile instead of the top of your library.  Nevermind, I guess Pyromaster is the first time.  That seems awfully late in time, though...

EDIT2: I'm mulling over your comments on Dakra Mystic, and I disagree with you.  This card is potentially very good for the same reason that Deathrite Shaman is good - it's practically a one-mana planeswalker.  It has a cheap activated ability which can do a variety of different things depending on the circumstances.

In the early game, you can use it to accelerate you and gain card advantage.  If you ever see an enemy bomb, you mill it, but otherwise just keep drawing cards faster.  This alone magnifies the advantage of decks running power, who can put those cards to use immediately.  

Kevin touched on a critical point that you both undersold - you get access to the sorcery speed cards first.  So, if you have a deck running Duress / Thoughtseize, you don't care too much if your opponent gets something useful; you're gonna to strip it out of their hand before they can cast it.  Heck, imagine this play:

"End step, tap Dakra.  I see Cabal Therapy.  You see <<something awesome>>.   Okay, lets draw.  My turn, Cabal Therapy naming the awesome card I saw your draw and looking at the rest of your hand.  Oh, you have something critical in there that is about to kill me?  Sac mystic to therapy away the other bad card."

In mid or late game, I think Dakra's role shifts from accelerating you into controlling the opponent.  It's true that Dakra is worse than Jace in a situation where you push them past a bad card.  But, remember, you're seeing half of the cards they draw and getting a choice about them.  In a format full of singletons, that choice matters.  They're only half as likely to topdeck a restricted bomb while you're hitting them with Mystic.

So, contrary to what you're saying, I see Dakra being very valuable in kind of a mid-rangey merfolk or BUG deck.  Turn 1 duress, turn 2 mystic, turn 3 go to valuetown is a fine start.

EDIT3: Finished the podcast.  Great job as always!  I think Kevin is spot on about Disciple of Deceit.  It'll be slow to adopt but people will try it.

One more comment: you did not cover Kruphix' Insight.  As a three casting cost card that potentially draws you three cards while showing you six, and having astounding synergy with Animate Dead effects, this is another potential role-player.



« Last Edit: May 09, 2014, 09:25:44 am by MaximumCDawg » Logged
nedleeds
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« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2014, 01:02:16 pm »

Another advantage that Aegis of the Gods has over True Believer that should be noted is that you can target yourself with Ancestral Recall with Aegis in play, but not True Believer.  Making 4-color humans another option as well as junk.

I think analyzing this guy as a lone warrior isn't a great way to look at him. All the 2 mana hate bears are better evaluated in the context of a deck with 16-24 total creatures. The strategy behind the hate bear decks is to attack across a couple of axis, and not just one, all the while presenting a reasonable clock. So by himself he's not necessarily a lock, if he's alongside a Thalia (probably Thalia coming down first on the play ideally) it begins to make it tough for say an Oath deck to crawl out -- one turn to make a mox, maybe another to pay 2B for a tutor, another for 1BG for Abrupt ... etc.. You also compare to Meddling Mage which is fine, but alongside Meddling Mage (naming say Abrupt Decay or Chain of Vapor) the lock becomes 'harder'.

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Smmenen
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« Reply #6 on: May 09, 2014, 05:45:13 pm »

Thanks for the feedback all!   If you listened to the show, please let us know what you think!  Also, be sure to suggest topics for future shows or areas you would like to see us discuss more. 
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« Reply #7 on: May 09, 2014, 07:44:03 pm »

We want to see more Vintage scenarios!

It would be keen to have a show on Vintage aggo / fish and discuss the scenarios there.  They might not be as complicated, but it would be good nod to these kind of decks that you have not done yet.
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« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2014, 11:09:11 pm »

Dakra Mystic also has great synergy with Spirit of the Labyrinth. Thought I should point that out.

EDIT: Guys, Prophetic Flamespeaker will most likely be seen in a Humans list. You will have the mana to cast both the cards (they will likely be 2-drops or less). All your cards are pro-active. This card does not belong in RUG or any Gush list in my opinion. You can play this guy off a turn 1 Deathrite Shaman or a turn 1 Noble Hierarch if you have an opening of Cavern into another 5-C land. I could go on with reasons. The fact that you guys only focused on decks where this really isn't appropriate shocks me a bit. Do you guys not see how this is a huge weapon for 5-Color Human lists? It is a new draw engine that draws potentially more than 1 card a turn and deals you 0 damage (unlike bob).
« Last Edit: May 09, 2014, 11:27:27 pm by Stormanimagus » Logged

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« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2014, 09:55:42 am »

Great podcast. I liked all the analysis you guys did on each card.
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« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2014, 10:42:59 am »

Nice show; thanks for posting.

Aegis of the Gods is an upgrade to True Believer but not enough to warrant a maindeck slot at this time.  Meddling Mage is not spectacular against Oath of Druids because what you want in an answer is something that can interact with the dreadful Orchard, Mox, Oath hands that can hit before Mage is online.  For this reason, the best anti-Oath creature is War Priest of Thune, who is uncounterable w. Cavern naming Human, stays around to beat unlike Qasali (while having a more economical CC and no activation cost), can be played T1 with an off-color mox, and doesn't simply wait around to be Decayed/bounced/removed like Grafdigger's Cage.  FWIW, by contrast, a Bomberman deck is going to prefer Cage to a hate bear every time because the Cage is fetched with Trinket Mage and can be recurred w. Auriok Salvagers.  But 4C/5C Humans will want War Priest.  What could put Aegis of the Gods in a maindeck position would be a confluence of events like a big return of Mindslaver, the unrestriction of Gifts Ungiven (which targets), something Intuition based that becomes widely played, or another new card that becomes very popular and requires targeting.  It's also potentially maindeckable in a shell that can take advantage of its enchantment status, via Serra's Sanctum, Enchantress, or Zur, the Enchanter.  I had the displeasure of facing a Zur/hate deck recently and it was surprisingly powerful.       

Mayor of Avabruck is still a fine card, but Humans have evolved in response to metagame changes (like Workshop using tools to combat aggro such as Wurmcoil Engine and Staff of Nin).  The Mayor's function is now mostly performed by Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch, Mistcutter Hydra, and Stoneforge Mystic.  In other cases, Humans are using combo-finishes including Tendrils of Agony, Time Vault, and Auriok Salvagers.

While I agree with the overall analysis of Eidolon of the Great Revel, it does have a very relevant attribute that wasn't discussed and that is being able to redirect its damage to an opponent's planeswalker.

I also agree with the analysis on the Eidolon of Rhetoric.  I was however confused when it was stated that Ethersworn Canonist has not been seen in Vintage since 2012.  I definitely have her in many sideboards and participated in several events this year and last.  Maybe morphling.de has become substantially incomplete.

Great analysis on Dack Fayden. 

Er, what about Elkin Lair?

It's in Visions which is younger than Ice Age.
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« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2014, 08:28:17 pm »

Thanks guys! Great episode as always!

One point I don't think you guys brought up about Prophetic Flamespeaker is that he is insane with equipment. The Jitte and Sword of Fire and Ice synergies are obvious, and Sword of Feast and Famine will untap your lands twice just in time for you to "draw" your free cards (how convenient). All three let you swing into Lodestone Golem and live, btw.
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« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2014, 09:05:52 pm »

My only criticism is: Make more episodes! Smile They're superb. Please keep up the good work.
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« Reply #13 on: May 11, 2014, 09:32:50 am »

I think the thing you guys may have glossed over, though it isn't a single card thing, is the number of enchantment creatures we now have that may be playable together and how that could create/alter a list. Specifically the ones in enchantress/Sanctum colors.

Spirit of the Labyrinth
Courser of Kruphix
Aegis of the Gods
Eidolon of Countless Battles
Eidolon of Rhetoric
Heliod

I would love to see a more holistic approach to set review in the future that tries to weigh how a new set may shift the meta, not just single cards. RTR was a bunch of single cards but for instance deathrite, Abrupt Decay, and Golgari charm potentially as a side really increased the value of that color combo, etc.
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« Reply #14 on: May 12, 2014, 12:35:19 pm »

I also was looking forward to hearing discussion of Kruphix's Insight. It is conditional, but any time a potential Draw-3 for 3 or less mana is printed, it warrants discussion.

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Smmenen
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« Reply #15 on: May 12, 2014, 12:42:15 pm »

We reviewed all of the cards that folks asked us to review.  We ask folks to tell us which cards to review on twitter, etc.  If you have a card you'd like us to review, let us know via PM, twitter, message, or otherwise email the show at the show email. 
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