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Author Topic: The Force Awakens  (Read 20370 times)
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« Reply #60 on: November 07, 2015, 02:28:09 pm »

Teaser 1 made me want to boycott the movie. Design is very important to me. The cross guard light sabre was something I'm sure I drew when I was 9 years old...then when I was 11 said looked like crap. I'm not in a field of design or anything so I wasn't some child fantasy prodigy. This movie needs to do better than 9 year old me. The ice cream bar speeder looks atrocious. I hated the FIFA droid until I found out it was not CGI and uses existing technology.

Teaser 2 has me hooked. Maybe the movie does need to do more than mine nostalgia, but nostalgia it must have. Luke reprising his line from RotJ gave me chills. I'm also a sucker for a dystopian setting. All that shiny shit in new prequel made me nauseous. I love the charred Vader mask and the scuttled Star Destroyer. I need to see more wrecked things.

On the subject of design, Kylo Ren looks like crap. His mask looks like the face of the snitch from Mos Eisley--not flattering! He looks like he's wearing some sale rack goth/cyber punk clothes. Knight of the Old Republic 1&2 were doing it right. If they just straight up stole from KotOR, I would settle for that. 
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« Reply #61 on: November 07, 2015, 03:24:30 pm »

Teaser 1 made me want to boycott the movie. Design is very important to me. The cross guard light sabre was something I'm sure I drew when I was 9 years old...then when I was 11 said looked like crap. I'm not in a field of design or anything so I wasn't some child fantasy prodigy. This movie needs to do better than 9 year old me. The ice cream bar speeder looks atrocious. I hated the FIFA droid until I found out it was not CGI and uses existing technology.

Teaser 2 has me hooked. Maybe the movie does need to do more than mine nostalgia, but nostalgia it must have. Luke reprising his line from RotJ gave me chills. I'm also a sucker for a dystopian setting. All that shiny shit in new prequel made me nauseous. I love the charred Vader mask and the scuttled Star Destroyer. I need to see more wrecked things.

On the subject of design, Kylo Ren looks like crap. His mask looks like the face of the snitch from Mos Eisley--not flattering! He looks like he's wearing some sale rack goth/cyber punk clothes. Knight of the Old Republic 1&2 were doing it right. If they just straight up stole from KotOR, I would settle for that. 

The "look" of a movie is 100% the wrong priority in my opinion. It is important, don't get me wrong, but it certainly isn't the priority. The script and actors are priority number 1. The reason people remember The Empire Strikes Back with such fondness is that it is a brilliant script with hugely memorable characters.

People need to stop holding on to an expectation that any reboot need be nothing but nostalgia and flashy effects. J.J Abrams has basically pandered to that audience in the past (*cough cough* Star Trek *facepalm*) and it has not lead to good results. Just because this is a Star Wars movie doesn't mean the director or writers owe an acknowledgement of anything to the fans. The franchise itself should have iconic universes and characters that stand the test of time and THAT is why they should be in the film, not due to some sense of directorial obligation. Great films are often great in part because they don't care what the audience is going to think and they take a risk. I hope these movies do that.

-Storm
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« Reply #62 on: November 07, 2015, 04:02:33 pm »

true. I can't think of one thing that was visually dazzling in ESB but it was jam packed with Jedi wisdom, something the new prequel was lacking. ESB did 2 things, have a good script, and make sure Yoda didn't look like a Muppet. RotJ was the good looking movie. I-III were neither good looking nor show the Jedi wisdom that should have been in buckets in the old republic.
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« Reply #63 on: November 07, 2015, 05:23:19 pm »

On the subject of design, Kylo Ren looks like crap. His mask looks like the face of the snitch from Mos Eisley--not flattering!

I'm so glad that I'm not the only person who noticed that.
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RitNecroWin
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« Reply #64 on: November 10, 2015, 10:37:56 am »

Let's wait and see. The speculation goes in many directions and a fallen Luke is the hotest rumour:

http://www.theguardian.com/film/2015/oct/22/star-wars-the-force-awakens-luke-skywalker-dark-side-mark-hamill-jedi

Luke is in the trailer with R2 at 1:33 in this link...

Most rumors/speculation/leaked information suggests that Han/Chewie take Rey/Finn to see Maz Katana - the motion capture character that narrates the final trailer (and the newest TV spot.) Supposedly, she is a mystic and tells them about the past (in flashback.) So that image of luke, hooded, touching RDs dome is more than likely flashback...so we see Luke, but don't actually see Luke...
I think he's going ROTJ and waiting until the last frames to show us Luke: Jedi Master... I mean think how sexy and frustrating it will be to have this whole thing leading up to taking Luke back his lightsaber and we FINALLY see him and we cut to credits... you better believe EVERYONE is running to the sequel.
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« Reply #65 on: November 10, 2015, 10:39:52 am »

On the subject of design, Kylo Ren looks like crap. His mask looks like the face of the snitch from Mos Eisley--not flattering!

I'm so glad that I'm not the only person who noticed that.

Yeah- I'm not crazy about the Kylo mask at all... it does look a bit like Garindan!
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« Reply #66 on: November 10, 2015, 03:31:48 pm »

Anyone notice in the latest japanese trailer that Rey, while crying and talking about hope despite all odds or some-such, is hunched over what seem to be the body of a wookie......
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« Reply #67 on: November 10, 2015, 03:47:07 pm »

Anyone notice in the latest japanese trailer that Rey, while crying and talking about hope despite all odds or some-such, is hunched over what seem to be the body of a wookie......

I will eat a Lotus on Youtube if Chewie bites it... it will be Han (and I suspect that particular scene is Finn on the ground after being bested by Kylo and Rey about to FINALLY pick up a lightsaber and go ape.)
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« Reply #68 on: November 16, 2015, 10:44:43 am »

true. I can't think of one thing that was visually dazzling in ESB
I don't know how you can say that when the duel between Luke and Vader in the cryogenic chamber is in that movie. The contrasts of reds and blues on their lightsabers and in the room when they first square off is seared into my brain.
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« Reply #69 on: November 17, 2015, 03:59:40 pm »



Indeed. Trailer was awesome, but I'm concerned that the film will only trade in nostalgia.  

As more time passes and more leaks present themself... I fear that you are correct.

I compiled several of the potential leaked plot synopsis and then went through each trailer frame by frame and tried to line things up... It's like he took elements from each film in the original trilogy, threw it in a blender and called it a day.

I still think it will be awesome and better than the prequels (doesn't take much) but now I am getting concerned that it is going to rely heavily on nostalgia.

It pains me to feed your ego Steve Smile  I think you are right.
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« Reply #70 on: November 17, 2015, 04:16:06 pm »

I hate to compound your fears, but your search for plot leaks will also undermine the theatrical experience and lessen the surprise and enjoyment of the film. Avoid spoilers!
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« Reply #71 on: November 28, 2015, 03:40:48 pm »

Star Wars is incredible.  Star Wars toys were the best thing to get from Santa.  And I watched all the movies many times.  Anytime it comes on TV, It's attention grabbing.  The last trilogy was pretty weak but that was sort of the times then.  The times are better now, so it will be an awesome movie.
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« Reply #72 on: November 28, 2015, 10:59:07 pm »

I just got to see the Japanese prerelease of The Force Awakens with subtitles (friend of mine is connected). The movie is great, but i can't believe the Empire destroys the Millenium Falcon!!!  Chewie and Han, you will be missed.  I know they were "old" according to timeline, but i didn't see the need to kill them off.  Maybe they'll be like ghosts that Luke got to see in RotJ in the next 2 episodes.

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« Reply #73 on: December 17, 2015, 11:40:45 am »

NO SPOILERS!!!

I saw it yesterday... the nostalgia is there, but doesn't rely on it to carry the film... it looks and feels like an original Star Wars film...
I need more time to digest... It's better than the prequals... I can't say it's better than ROTJ... it MIGHT be on par... but I'm still in the hype bubble and need to have a few more viewings... no fan will be dissapointed... I can and will nitpick after a few weeks when spoilers have occurred.

May the Force be with you all!
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« Reply #74 on: December 18, 2015, 03:18:25 am »

NO SPOILERS!!!

I saw it yesterday... the nostalgia is there, but doesn't rely on it to carry the film... it looks and feels like an original Star Wars film...
I need more time to digest... It's better than the prequals... I can't say it's better than ROTJ... it MIGHT be on par... but I'm still in the hype bubble and need to have a few more viewings... no fan will be dissapointed... I can and will nitpick after a few weeks when spoilers have occurred.

May the Force be with you all!

Of course you can, it's easily better than ROTJ. I've got it right in there with ANH, all things considered.
Really enjoyed it, some really good moments.
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« Reply #75 on: December 19, 2015, 03:27:38 pm »

Just saw it. For the first half or so, I found it hard to turn off my inner star wars geek who was analyzing everything and just watch. I'll probably go see it in the theater at least once more.
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« Reply #76 on: December 22, 2015, 07:45:15 pm »



Indeed. Trailer was awesome, but I'm concerned that the film will only trade in nostalgia.  

As more time passes and more leaks present themself... I fear that you are correct.

I'm glad to find out that I was not correct here.  There is no doubt that this film extracted much from the original trilogy, but very pleased that it didn't rest its laurels on nostalgia, but introduced novel elements and took risks. 

I've seen TFA twice, and enjoyed it both times.  I'm probably going to see a third time in the theatre. 
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« Reply #77 on: December 23, 2015, 11:12:33 pm »

so, who is Snoke exactly? Shouldn't this be known somehow?
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« Reply #78 on: December 24, 2015, 10:41:42 am »

I've seen it seven times now...my opinion of it changed dramatically on the second viewing and I fel like it was New Hope redux...then on the 4th viewing I stopped feeling that way and just accepted that it's a really fun film with great new characters...I'm back to thinking it's slightly better than ROTJ actually.
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« Reply #79 on: December 24, 2015, 05:00:51 pm »

I assume it's now OK to post spoilers --

I really hated the movie. The beginning was ok, and the new characters are awesome, but the writing, dear god, the writing. TFA is a "reboot" of ANH in the most literal sense of the word: you can line up the two plots and they match, point for point. I nearly walked out of the theater when the Death Star planet was revealed (really???! The Death Star was already tired when it came back in RotJ) and again when it became clear that the First Order were taking orders from Supreme Leader Kim Jong Muppet.

Kylo is a terrible villain. Where Darth Vader was ruthless, efficient, and menacing, Kylo is some angsty and incompetent teenager that the First Order has for some reason placed in a leadership position. The mind boggles.

The First Order has the resources to hollow out a PLANET and capture the energy of a SUN and yet it can't muster up more than a dozen ships to defend said planet's weak points??? And if you can just slip past the planet's defenses through hyperspace, the rebellion could have just launched an asteroid through hyperspace and had it come out right on top of the "temperature resonance regulator" or whatever.

JJ Abrams does his usual thing of having one character say, "the world will end in 30 seconds!!" followed by action scenes that would take at least 4 hours to perform. But at this point I'm just nitpicking. Watching TFA was a bitter disappointment after all the hype, and I wish I had spent my money re-watching The Martian instead.

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« Reply #80 on: December 29, 2015, 09:51:06 am »

I was beginning to think I was the only one who thought this movie was awful.  All the nods to the fan moments kept pulling me out of the movie.  'Reveal millinium falcon' I made an audible groan.  It was not the last groan I made.  Rey seemed to have no arch.  She was more powerful than Luke by the end of Jedi.  The thing that left me scratching my head the most was the rebels plan to follow the bread crumbs to Luke.  Why? How or why would anyone get behind that as their big plan?  The jedi were a joke and the behind the scenes struggle at the end of Jedi was privy to only three people and only one survived, Luke.  Then the big plan of the First Reich, ahem First order was to build another death star type thing?  Come on, that was so painful to see.  Once the Rebels were all in the battle room discussing how to blow up another big ball I was so far removed from the movie I swear Fonzie was giving me an 'EHHH!'  This really was all about nostalgia and for me that's not good enough.  I actually have a lot more respect for Lucas with the prequels now as he at least tried something different. 
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« Reply #81 on: December 29, 2015, 12:33:58 pm »

I assume it's now OK to post spoilers --

I really hated the movie. The beginning was ok, and the new characters are awesome, but the writing, dear god, the writing. TFA is a "reboot" of ANH in the most literal sense of the word: you can line up the two plots and they match, point for point. I nearly walked out of the theater when the Death Star planet was revealed (really???! The Death Star was already tired when it came back in RotJ) and again when it became clear that the First Order were taking orders from Supreme Leader Kim Jong Muppet.

Kylo is a terrible villain. Where Darth Vader was ruthless, efficient, and menacing, Kylo is some angsty and incompetent teenager that the First Order has for some reason placed in a leadership position. The mind boggles.

The First Order has the resources to hollow out a PLANET and capture the energy of a SUN and yet it can't muster up more than a dozen ships to defend said planet's weak points??? And if you can just slip past the planet's defenses through hyperspace, the rebellion could have just launched an asteroid through hyperspace and had it come out right on top of the "temperature resonance regulator" or whatever.

JJ Abrams does his usual thing of having one character say, "the world will end in 30 seconds!!" followed by action scenes that would take at least 4 hours to perform. But at this point I'm just nitpicking. Watching TFA was a bitter disappointment after all the hype, and I wish I had spent my money re-watching The Martian instead.



I assume you think A New Hope is a pile of shit as well? After all, the hero of that film is an angsty inexperienced teenager? The empire can build a moon sized battlestation but forget to plug the hole that leads to it's unstable core? They have 2 near omnipotent force users but neither can sense Vaders kid a few thousand yards from their omni-weapon?

New Hope is a cavalcade of unlikely events and bumbles by the empire.

I can't get behind the lame CGI Gollum Emperor Redux, I'm not sure where they are going with that, it looked like some aborted Photoshop file from Clone Wars.
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« Reply #82 on: December 29, 2015, 05:09:10 pm »

This was a bad movie. The character's development was non-existent. Rey is a nobody and in litterally 5min become a superhero. The angry teenage baddy is pathetic, you don't even understand what's going through his head. Solo is meant to be like an Ulysse, full of tricks, talk, etc... there is no way he would expose himself like he did without a plan. I guess given his age maybe they decided on terminating him. Maybe he cost too much too.

The dialogues were pathetic. Once I shut my eyes and it was all mono-syllabic.

The politics is non-existent. The scene were the rebellion come up with a plan in less than 3 min was laughable.

All in all, the scenario was poor, the character poor and it really felt like I've seen it all before.

I believe its a trilogy, they could have built a much darker setup. The village scene was ok, there was a glimpse of competition between the army general & Kylo Ren, they could have work on that as a wickness of the First order, more spy stuff, more betrayals, more tricks, more twists, more back & forth.... the solution being simply half a dozen fighters shooting at the cooling system is little lame.

Visually, a couple of great things but the movie bore me out. Maybe I grew up, but for the amount invested even the sound track wasn't great.

They played safe, didn't invent or reinvent anything. I'm sure there are dozen novels & sequels already written, I cant believe this was the best one they could dig out.
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« Reply #83 on: December 29, 2015, 09:46:53 pm »

I thought it was a good movie.  It was similar enough to a New Hope that it felt very Star Wars, but different enough to be it's only entity. 

I agree with nedleeds in that I really wonder what you'd all you critiques of the movie would think of a New Hope if it came out today.  The movie wasn't perfect, but neither were the original Star Wars movies. 

There was a ton of character development if you paid attention to it, and all of the characters actions made sense given this development.  Rey is certainly much more than a nobody.  She was left on the planet by someone (conspicuously around the same time Luke disappeared).  She's also been living on her own in a hostile environment since she was a child.  Han let himself die because he was tired of running.  He knew what he was trying was a long shot.  Kylo seems to be born some sort of psycopath, although he was under developed in this film.  This is also a set up for the trilogy and I'm sure we will learn the full story of Kylo and Rey in the next 2. 
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« Reply #84 on: December 29, 2015, 10:51:01 pm »

That's my point. In ANH they obtain a set of plans that point to a vent. Their plan, which they devise in 10 minutes is to shoot a bomb into the hole using like 10 ships, against an armada, oh with a untrained nobody who became a superhero in about 2 days. Luke's training is a hyperspace ride with Ben where he swings at a fucking wiffle ball with a lacrosse helmet on. I get it, if you think you think they both sucked, it's a perfectly reasonable opinion to have ... but I wonder why anybody who hates ANH would even bother with TFA? Maybe Krampus instead?
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« Reply #85 on: December 30, 2015, 02:38:32 pm »



Indeed. Trailer was awesome, but I'm concerned that the film will only trade in nostalgia.  

As more time passes and more leaks present themself... I fear that you are correct.

I'm glad to find out that I was not correct here.  There is no doubt that this film extracted much from the original trilogy, but very pleased that it didn't rest its laurels on nostalgia, but introduced novel elements and took risks.  

I've seen TFA twice, and enjoyed it both times.  I'm probably going to see a third time in the theatre.  

The best description that I've heard for this movie is that it's a "soft reboot."  They re-told much of the original story, filled many of the same roles, and traded on nostalgia, but that was just a jumping-off point.  The characters have new personalities and new flaws.  When George Lucas talked about "rhyming," this is a much better example of what he meant.

I look forward to where the director can now take the story, now that he has successfully budded off the original franchise in this way.

Kylo is a terrible villain. Where Darth Vader was ruthless, efficient, and menacing, Kylo is some angsty and incompetent teenager that the First Order has for some reason placed in a leadership position. The mind boggles.

It's totally fine not to like Kylo; you're not supposed to.  He's no Grand Admiral Thrawn, that's for sure.  The director took some risks with this character and I love it.  The obvious flaws give him somewhere to go in his character arc.  He's not your typical mindless archenemy, and that's good.

Plus, the parallels to Darth Vader actually make sense instead of just being stupid coincidences like in the prequel.  Remember, Vader too was a jerkoff whiny teenager initially, and even after putting on the mask he was a stew of personal conflicts.  You just didn't see much of that in the original trilogy because he had already killed everyone close to him that he could by that time.  (And let us never talk about the abomination that showed his original character arc in the prequels).  Kylo is trying to act like Vader specifically because Vader is his hero.

I assume you think A New Hope is a pile of shit as well? After all, the hero of that film is an angsty inexperienced teenager? The empire can build a moon sized battlestation but forget to plug the hole that leads to it's unstable core? They have 2 near omnipotent force users but neither can sense Vaders kid a few thousand yards from their omni-weapon?

While I like Kylo, this comparison isn't fair.  Luke is given to be a pretty blank slate in ANH.  He's just an everyman.  We don't get a whole lot of development of him in the first place except that he yearns for more than his little moisture farm in life, and then, mostly the events of ANH consist of things beyond his control pulling him along.  He grows over the trilogy until he's the one making things happen.  You're meant to project yourself onto him as someone exploring and mastering this new universe.

Here, Kylo's character is NOT meant to be a blank slate; he's a reckless villain that is driving much of the conflict.   You don't connect with him.

That's my point. In ANH they obtain a set of plans that point to a vent. Their plan, which they devise in 10 minutes is to shoot a bomb into the hole using like 10 ships, against an armada, oh with a untrained nobody who became a superhero in about 2 days. Luke's training is a hyperspace ride with Ben where he swings at a fucking wiffle ball with a lacrosse helmet on.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/death-star-architect-exhaust-ports_55e952dde4b093be51bb20ab
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« Reply #86 on: January 01, 2016, 10:09:06 am »

It's a good fun movie
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« Reply #87 on: January 03, 2016, 05:48:04 pm »

The "Rey is OP" arguments have got to stop.

First of all, we have already seen what minimally or never trained Force-sensitive folks can do. Luke blew up the Death Star, ffs. Anakin built C3-PO and competed in a sport which humans were notoriously incapable of handling. Luke spent a whole 2 days with Yoda and learned enough Force Hoodoo to not instantly fold to Vader.

Secondly - and how everyone forgets this, I have no idea - Kylo Ren was holding his insides in while he fought. He got hit by Chewie's insanely powerful crossbow, which is shown to all but obliterate every other thing it hits. Kylo has managed to not only *not* fall into a dozen pieces after this impact but he puts up a bloody good fight against two would-be attackers. He's worn out when Rey starts on him.

Considering Rey already demonstrated her fighting skills on Jakku (whatever her home planet is called) and she gets about as much "use t3h Force, holmes" guidance as Luke did when he started blindly deflecting lasers on the Falcon, I really don't see how this continues to be a point of contention for people.

Finally - and this should be pretty encouraging given JJ's usual one-shot approach to movie making - of ciyrse there are questions about Rey that have yet to be answered. There are two more movies! We have exposition waiting for us over the next couple of years; if Rey's character remains a total question mark by Ep IX, then yeah maybe we have a problem. But for now, I say it's enough story to keep me interested with enough questions to leave me in anticipation. I thought this movie was great.
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« Reply #88 on: January 04, 2016, 11:39:11 am »

Secondly - and how everyone forgets this, I have no idea - Kylo Ren was holding his insides in while he fought. He got hit by Chewie's insanely powerful crossbow, which is shown to all but obliterate every other thing it hits. Kylo has managed to not only *not* fall into a dozen pieces after this impact but he puts up a bloody good fight against two would-be attackers. He's worn out when Rey starts on him.

Yeah, the movie made a big deal about pointing out how injured Kylo was during this sequence.  First he gets his crotch blown off by the bowcaster, after they make a big deal about how powerful it is all movie long.  Then they show you not once, but twice that he's pounding his side and cringing at something very not right going on inside his body.  Then, they cut to the blood on the ground, and a reaction shot of Finn showing you he realizes he has a shot because this dork is already bleeding out... and then he takes a hit from Finn's wild swinging before he puts him down.  So, yeah, the director bent over backwards to explain why Kylo was an underdog in that fight.

Which I found really odd, because the movie did not give a poop about explaining all the hilariously awful science errors, usually having to do with scale.  (How large is a planet?  How large is a sun?  If you ate a sun and pooped it out at light speed, what would it look like to everyone else?  Would you see it from another planet far away? etc)
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« Reply #89 on: January 04, 2016, 12:39:54 pm »

Which I found really odd, because the movie did not give a poop about explaining all the hilariously awful science errors, usually having to do with scale.  (How large is a planet?  How large is a sun?  If you ate a sun and pooped it out at light speed, what would it look like to everyone else?  Would you see it from another planet far away? etc)

People keep to mention that part quite a lot. While it obviously makes no sense, I don't understand why this is such a big problem. It is just another superweapon, they wanted to make it look more powerful than the others. Granted, they could have made it a bit more sensible, but honestly, Star Wars has more in common with fantasy than science fiction, so I don't have a problem with it. For me, practical effects are way better in making the movie more believable than trying to explain magic (like the prequels). That is one of the major reasons why I think The Force Awakens is great.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2016, 12:48:18 pm by maciek16180 » Logged
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