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Author Topic: MTGO Power Nine Challenge - November 28, 2015  (Read 3512 times)
Smmenen
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« on: October 30, 2015, 08:08:50 pm »

The Power Nine Challenge

Start Times: Saturday, October 24, Saturday, November 28, and Saturday December 26, at 11:00 a.m. All times are Pacific (for UTC, add 7 hours)
Location: Scheduled Events
Entry Option:

    25 Event Tickets
    250 Play Points

Product: A Vintage-legal deck
Size: 33-512 players
Play Style: Swiss, with Top 8
Format: Constructed
Duration: A number of rounds determined by attendance, each round up to 50 minutes.
Prizes:

 Place    Prizes    QPs
1st    A Vintage Masters Black Lotus, a Vintage Masters Timetwister, a complete premium Battle for Zendikar set, a complete non-premium Battle for Zendikar set, and 500 Play Points    6
2nd    A Vintage Masters Ancestral Recall, a complete non-premium Battle for Zendikar set, and 400 Play Points    5
3rd    A Vintage Masters Mox Sapphire and 300 Play Points    4
4th    A Vintage Masters Mox Ruby and 300 Play Points    4
5th    A Vintage Masters Mox Jet and 250 Play Points    3
6th    A Vintage Masters Mox Pearl and 250 Play Points    3
7th    A Vintage Masters Mox Emerald and 250 Play Points    3
8th    A Vintage Masters Time Walk and 250 Play Points    3
9th-16th    250 Play Points    0

http://magic.wizards.com/en/MTGO/articles/archive/magic-online/october-2015-event-changes-2015-10-19
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Smmenen
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« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2015, 02:20:31 pm »

Wizards has boosted the prize pool a bit and extended it downward to top 32.

Updated Prizes here:

Prizes:

    1st Place: Vintage Masters Black Lotus, Vintage Masters Timetwister, complete premium Battle for Zendikar set, complete non-premium Battle for Zendikar set, 500 Play Points, 6 Qualifier Points
    2nd Place: Vintage Masters Ancestral Recall, complete non-premium Battle for Zendikar set, 500 Play Points, 5 Qualifier Points
    3rd Place: Vintage Masters Mox Sapphire, Tempest Wasteland, 300 Play Points, 4 Qualifier Points
    4th Place: Vintage Masters Mox Ruby, Vintage Masters Force of Will, 300 Play Points, 4 Qualifier Points
    5th Place: Vintage Masters Mox Jet, 250 Play Points, 3 Qualifier Points
    6th Place: Vintage Masters Mox Pearl, 250 Play Points, 3 Qualifier Points
    7th Place: Vintage Masters Mox Emerald, 250 Play Points, 3 Qualifier Points
    8th Place: Vintage Masters Time Walk, 250 Play Points, 3 Qualifier Points
    9th-32nd place: 250 Play Points

http://wizardsmtgo.tumblr.com/

I'm really looking forward to this event!  Be sure to join!
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« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2015, 03:14:15 pm »

hot!
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« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2015, 04:26:56 pm »

Prizes:

    1st Place: Vintage Masters Black Lotus, Vintage Masters Timetwister, complete premium Battle for Zendikar set, complete non-premium Battle for Zendikar set, 500 Play Points, 6 Qualifier Points
    2nd Place: Vintage Masters Ancestral Recall, complete non-premium Battle for Zendikar set, 500 Play Points, 5 Qualifier Points
    3rd Place: Vintage Masters Mox Sapphire, Tempest Wasteland, 300 Play Points, 4 Qualifier Points
    4th Place: Vintage Masters Mox Ruby, Vintage Masters Force of Will, 300 Play Points, 4 Qualifier Points
    5th Place: Vintage Masters Mox Jet, 250 Play Points, 3 Qualifier Points
    6th Place: Vintage Masters Mox Pearl, 250 Play Points, 3 Qualifier Points
    7th Place: Vintage Masters Mox Emerald, 250 Play Points, 3 Qualifier Points
    8th Place: Vintage Masters Time Walk, 250 Play Points, 3 Qualifier Points
    9th-32nd place: 250 Play Points


Man - I won't be able to make these until hockey season is over, but that's a nice list.

AND the prices of most of the P9 have gone UP since the announcement (though only a couple points ) it's only getting better. 

What's the max players in this?  256?
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« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2015, 04:28:22 pm »

The payout on this is much nicer (and more sensible) than last time around. It's still super heavy on first place but the other top spots aren't bad.

Using retail pricing (GoatBots, MTGOTraders when GoatBots not available) and WotC's conversion rate of 10 points = 1 tix = 1 USD

1 $581.96
2 $163.48
3 $160.31
4 $85.98
5 $56.99
6 $51.49
7 $47.49
8 $52.49
9-32 $25.00

the math

To me, it's especially nice that it's a lot easier to break even.

I do find it amusing that the cards they're giving out kinda shows some of the problems with MTGO pricing. The Wasteland is the second most valuable card they're giving out. First place gets a Timetwister; the single least valuable thing they're giving out.
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Smmenen
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« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2015, 05:01:47 pm »

I think the prize pool still has room for improvement, but if this event causes power to go up in price over time, then it will even out in the end/.

Who is playing in this?
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desolutionist
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« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2015, 05:09:43 pm »

I am. But I won't know what I'm playing until 5 minutes before the event
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« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2015, 05:11:14 pm »

Sadly I'll be out of town for Thanksgiving. I wish they would have tried harder to avoid holidays with these events in the next two months.

Best of luck to everyone competing!
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CHaPuZaS
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« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2015, 06:06:22 pm »

If nothing goes wrong, I'll play it. The prize improvement is incredible.
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« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2015, 07:02:33 pm »

The payout on this is much nicer (and more sensible) than last time around. It's still super heavy on first place but the other top spots aren't bad.

Using retail pricing (GoatBots, MTGOTraders when GoatBots not available) and WotC's conversion rate of 10 points = 1 tix = 1 USD

1 $581.96
2 $163.48
3 $160.31
4 $85.98
5 $56.99
6 $51.49
7 $47.49
8 $52.49
9-32 $25.00

the math

To me, it's especially nice that it's a lot easier to break even.

I do find it amusing that the cards they're giving out kinda shows some of the problems with MTGO pricing. The Wasteland is the second most valuable card they're giving out. First place gets a Timetwister; the single least valuable thing they're giving out.

The 10 PP = 1 tix = 1 USD assumption is very, very weak.

The correct thing to do for a given event (IMO) is to imagine that all the Play Points are reinvested in the same event with a 50% matchup win-rate. So for example, if I play Vintage Dailies every day PP are worth some number of packs, something along the lines of 43 PP = 1 Booster. Obviously this is just counter to fact if you win well above 50% of the time on a sustained basis or you only enter 1-off events, but I think it's substantially more counter to fact to give PP the full value of 1tix per 10 PP (implicitly assuming a zero % win-rate in future events, such that the two are perfect substitutes)

For example, pretend there's an event that costs 100 PP to enter, has 8 players, and pays out 400 PP and 5 boosters for 1st place. Assuming a 50% winrate (which is tautologically the case from WotC's perspective; except for bye rounds) you get an expected payout of 50 PP and 5/8 boosters per player. Given that, each 10 PP used to enter the event is worth 1/8 booster packs. The winner's 400 PP are then actually worth around 5 booster packs, which is only $20 or less in value, rather than $40. If the event is great value, then PP are actually better than a straight dollar prize, but typically they are going to be worth less than 1/10 tix each.

Since we don't know how many players will show up, we can't simply plug PP back into the same event. If we use Vintage Dailies instead (let's face it, this is where most of us are going to use any PP we win) we get a rate of 10 PP = 0.2143 Boosters = 0.8358 Tix. Those $25 prize payouts are actually worth more like $20.89, but on the flip side the entry cost (for PP entries) is more like $20.89 and less like $25.

As to the event itself, this is a huge upgrade over what they offered last month. Hopefully the prize support helps grow Vintage online and each month can keep building on the energy and excitement of the last one.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2015, 07:45:44 pm by ajfirecracker » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2015, 09:53:24 pm »

Quote
The 10 PP = 1 tix = 1 USD assumption is very, very weak.

Agreed. I have over 1,000 Play Points sitting useless in my account, and I certainly cannot use them as well as I could use 100 TIX.
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« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2015, 11:13:51 pm »

I am. But I won't know what I'm playing until 5 minutes before the event

I will be too but given my history with Magic Online, I won't know what I'm playing until I draw my opening hand. (All decks with Vedalken Aethermage will be deleted before signing up, I can guarantee that).
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« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2015, 12:44:23 am »

Good improvement prize wise. 3th and 4th seems solid.
I'm in too.
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« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2015, 01:08:03 am »

That happened to me in the last Daily. That's what I get for trying Beaver's Hydra Gro deck. I looked at my opening hand anticipating a bunch of broken cards like Mox Opal and Timetwister and instead it's like 3 lands, a gush, and some counterspells. LOL
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« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2015, 03:38:40 am »

Previously, I was relieved I never had to worry about MTGO anything because I knew preemptively that I would never join if infinite loops remained impossible.  The work Rich and Stephen have done to foment these positive changes is making the program appealing now.  I find myself hoping they fix the Auriok defect and then I may be excited to join.  Great work, Rich and Stephen. 

-B
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« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2015, 11:39:11 am »

I'm certaintly going to play in this! I hope to make top8 again, that was awesome. It's pleasure to see, that they increased the prize pool a little Smile

I'm excited to see what people bring to this big event. I suspect the majority will be on Mentor decks with tiny Jace, also a lot Dredge and i have a hunch that MUD will make a comeback as well(perhaps not T8) but still present. I dont expect to see a lot of Oath's, but it will be there as well along with other combo decks(storm)
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« Reply #16 on: November 27, 2015, 11:04:43 pm »

What's the max players in this?  256?

I hadn't seen anyone answer this - from TFA, the max is 512.
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Smmenen
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« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2015, 11:41:48 pm »

Yeah, I wouldn't worry about hitting the max Smile

Although one person is already signed up.  

EDIT: 10:30 and we already have 43 players!
« Last Edit: November 28, 2015, 01:32:19 pm by Smmenen » Logged

Smmenen
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« Reply #18 on: November 28, 2015, 02:29:49 pm »

final count is 93 players.  another huge success.
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« Reply #19 on: November 28, 2015, 02:39:53 pm »

final count is 93 players.  another huge success.
Frankly speaking I expected more players this time.
We'll see next time, maybe its due to Thanksgiving.
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CHaPuZaS
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« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2015, 07:59:50 pm »

Players qualified are already in the Top8.

I guess this player's decklists will be posted in WotC's site.



I missed the chance of repeating Top8 for the tiebreakers... But Rich Shay did it!

On a side note, considering that the prizes were upgraded, and the success of the last month, I also expected more than 100 players, maybe getting to 150, but almost a hundred of them is also a nice quantity.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2015, 08:20:59 pm by CHaPuZaS » Logged

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Smmenen
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« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2015, 08:25:13 pm »

the timing - at the end of the month - will surely hurt for this and next month - but I think we'll have a nice uptick in January, if they keep this thing going, as i hope they do. 
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« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2015, 11:10:27 pm »

I recorded some commentary on the Top 8 matches  once the event ended (and the client allowed me to watch replays)

For anyone interested, they're available here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swolx2EkBqM&list=PLwGy3yc_3RDT1EwRo0U82zrG36cHDHUa1
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kingneckbeard on MTGO

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« Reply #23 on: November 29, 2015, 03:29:21 am »

I owe apologise to BrassMan for my poor play on game 2 with him. It was around midnight here and my baby woked up as we started 2nd game. I was just running from living room to bedroom and pretty much blindly clicking on client. Murphy's law, he felt to sleep on game 3 when I mulled to oblivion. At least I finished as 32nd.
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« Reply #24 on: November 29, 2015, 07:35:19 am »

I started well, then lost a narrow one to Dale Cooper's very nice Merfolk build, then got tired and fell apart.. still: had a good time and was really glad to see this hit roughly a hundred players again. I figured everyone in the US would be too busy with holidays and family, so I think it's a very respectable showing. Let's keep it up! As I was saying to Brassman on Twitter, we really have the chance with this event to make it the biggest, regularly held Vintage tournament worldwide - and that would do wonders for the format.

Congrats to Efro and the rest of the Top 8. Look forward to seeing all the lists - and the VSLers in action very soon.

Have good weekends, one and all.
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« Reply #25 on: November 29, 2015, 03:34:25 pm »

Top16 deck lists : http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/mtgo-standings/vintage-premier-2015-11-29
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Smmenen
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« Reply #26 on: November 29, 2015, 04:38:50 pm »

I spent a couple hours lasr night combing through the results on MTGO, and have a complete metagame breakdown of all 93 decks I'll publish on Eternal Central in the next week or so.  FYI.
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« Reply #27 on: November 29, 2015, 04:54:59 pm »

That's great, Steve. Are you able to get both archetypes and matchup results? If so that could be a great font of information.
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« Reply #28 on: November 29, 2015, 06:02:11 pm »

17 Dark Rituals in top 16. Only 8 Workshops.
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« Reply #29 on: November 29, 2015, 06:23:37 pm »

the timing - at the end of the month - will surely hurt for this and next month - but I think we'll have a nice uptick in January, if they keep this thing going, as i hope they do. 

Yep. I even bought some new cards for this tournament but audibled at the last minute to post-Thanksgiving festivities :/

17 Dark Rituals in top 16. Only 8 Workshops.

Very interesting. I think that says that workshops are still good but Ritual is no longer [almost] completely shut out.
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