1) Is Engineered Explosives also the reason you cut 1 Fire/Ice for REB?

2) Why did you cut the Mox Ruby?

3) Are you happy with Faerie Conclave, why did you include it?

4) What are Chain of Vapor for in the SB?

5) Why 4 Ingot/1 E.Flux and not 3/2 or 2/3. E.Flux is such a house against Stax.

Sorry for the interrigation, but I love this deck and want to understand your decisions

Josh, what's up with the Rod/Explosives, what are the pros/cons?

What's up with the proxies? :-/

According to statistics from Momondo, the cheapest plane tickets is bought 8 weeks before departure, in the morning

Attended last year. Nice people, nice city, great food, great price support, cheap vendors just promise me you will have more than one toilet this year then I will bring my friends to Italy

Thanks. I don't own Black Lotus, that is the only reason I don't run it (no-proxy). In a fullpowered metagame I would do the same side except -2 Ancient Grudge, +2 Ingor Chewer.

Just won a tournament (1st was 4 FoW) with the BB18 list -Steel Sabotage, -Black Lotus, +Brainstorm, +Tropical Island.

Side was:
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Yixlid Jailer
2 Underground Sea
3 Energy Flux
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Firespout

Going 6-1 losing only to Belcher because of poor mulligan skills.

I played merfolks in Vintage in 2010... did quite okay with it considering the low powerlevel.

1) Play 4 Energy Flux in the side (single handedly wins MUD matchups)
2) Play 2 Mental Misstep (Branstorm, Ritual, Voltaic Key, Swords, jada jada...)
3) Drop Kira (It's not worth it considering you will not meet Zoo in Vintage)
4) Drop Dismember (Your creatures are bigger an

What do you side OUT against Dredge? And do you side in Firespout? (already side in 4xLeyline of the Void, 2xYixlid Jailer and 2xUnderground Sea)


Good luck bouncing those Empty the Warrens or Bridge from Below tokens...

Printing this so I have something to read on my way home from work... Nice length

Sorry for Necroing...

How does this list look? (posting for a friend of mine)

4 Llanwar Elves
4 Fyndhorn Elves
4 Heritage Druid
4 Nettle Sentinel
4 Quirion Ranger
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Wirewood Symbiote
2 Viridian Shaman
3 Vengevine
3 Birchlore Rangers
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Thorm
1 Grapeshot
1 Regal Force
4 Glimpse of Nature
3 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Skullclamp
6 Fetch
5 Forest
1 Taiga
4 Gaea's Cradle

Can win with Storm, Emrakul or pure beatdown (Elves, Vengevine, Regal Force)
Has three draws: Skullclamp, Glimpse, Regal
Will play in a field of semi-powered decks and some budget decks...

Josh: what do you think about this change:

-1 Island, +1 Tropical Island

Not much, but it will support 2 x Ancient Grudge in the SB and 1-3 x Firespout in the SB (all metadependant)

YEEEEAH BABY!!!!!!!!!

Mod: Sorry for caps, I just got very excited about this.

What is you gameplan against Noble Fish and GW Hatebears? If you where to designate 5+ SB slots to these matchups, what would it be?

Jay! In what city?

Thanks Yeah this year weekend is on 31/1 (terrible) but the week after 7/8 would have been perfect. Also Germany is pretty nice when it comes to travel cost as it has big airports and cheap hotels

Beside from the usual BoM in may, any other tournaments worth attending in Europe?

   

Could not have agreed more. I played Merfolks in my first Vintage tournament (BoM3). Scared of all the t1 wins and power 9. I choose 4 Null Rod md and 4 Energy Flux sb, won easily against a lot of tier 1 decks... Choosing the right weapons at the right time is key to victory. Nevermind how strong that gush, bazaar or blightsteel are. 

What about 2 Ancient Grudge instead? And -1 Island, +1 Tropical Island in the main?

Thanks, did some testing this weekend with this side:

4 Red Elemental Blast
3 Yixlid Jailer
1 Trinket Mage
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Aether Spellbomb
1 Meekstone
1 Pithing Needle
1 Relic of Progenitus (Edit: 1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor)
2 Ingot Chewer

Not sure about the Ingot Chewers tough... could perhaps be some other artifacthate, more tech for toolbox, or something against aggro.

Thanks, also added a Meekstone (my meta) and Aether Spellbomb for my sideboard toolbox.

I have recently purchased a Mox Jet. Not sure what to remove from the deck. Sol Ring and Mana Crypt is nice as they gives me  (much needed). I could do a switch -1 Wasteland, +1 Mox Jet (my favourite), does it seem okay?

Thank you. I will do that. I will also read some of the decklist provided by Florian Hess, do you know if he has written any reports? I will necro this thread as soon as I play this build in a tournament, hopefully soon

MD: 1 Echoing Truth, 1 Hurkyl’s Recall, 3 Bolts+1 Fire/Ice (Revoker) + 10 counterspells.


Yeah, paying 3 instead of 5 seems like a valid argument for Tormod’s Crypt. I did the black splash you recommended and forget about the Tinker for now. I cut 4 Islands for 2 more fetches and 2 Underground Sea. Not sure if that is the correct number, it may be 3 or 4, and fetches may be from 4 to 6. I am also beginning to ponder about the 6 colorless lands in my pool. Library of Alexandria seems pretty safe, so does the single Strip Mine. But what about the Wasteland? Hopefully sometime soon I can trade 1 of them for 1 Mox Jet. But does my manabase look solid enough to run 6 colorless lands? Thank you for your time 

Not your day eh? If Tinker-BSC is such an issue for you, play hate

I don’t have more information about the metagame, only the one mentioned in the OP, sorry. I am unsure about the presence of blue (50%-75%), nothing compared to top level tournaments. Due to aggro, hatebears, Bob and Lackey perhaps this should be Lightning Bolt instead?

I disagree. I haven’t seen a lot of t3 or t4 wins lately, at least not when I counter their Ritual, Lackey or Oath. But you may be correct; I guess I will find out in my next tournament.

Petal is an easy cut, I just play it because I don’t have lotus. Preordains is for digging, but with 4 Trinket Mage to find the 2 Grindstones and some draw to find one of the four Painter’s Servant perhaps Preordain is not needed. Will cut; -1 Lotus Petal, -1 Preordain, +1 Mana Crypt, +1 Sensei’s Divining Top. MD Tormod’s Crypt seems dead in some situations? But against Dredge, Reanimator, Tarmogoyf, Vengevinecombo, Yawgmoth’s Will…. Perhaps not. Are you sure Crypt is better than Relic of Progenitus? Would like to hear some more of your arguments about this. Anyways: -1 Preordain, +1 Tormod’s Crypt.


Yes. Would like to build around Mana Drain and Grindstone. I’m not sure about the black splash tough. Vampiric, Demonic, Bob x 4 is 6 slots. Not sure what to take out. I'm beginning to like this build more and more with the two colors currently played. If going to fit 4xBob, 1xVampiric and 1xDemonic, what would you take out?

Edit:

Jace the Painter

1 Mana Crypt
1 Sol Ring
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Echoing Truth
4 Force of Will
1 Hurkyl's Recall
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Mana Drain
1 Misdirection (Blightsteel Colossus?)
1 Mystical Tutor
2 Mental Misstep
1 Preordain (Tinker?)
1 Sensei’s Divining Top
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Brainstorm
1 Time Walk
3 Lightning Bolt
4 Painter’s Servant
4 Trinket Mage
2 Grindstone
1 Fire / Ice

1 Flooded Strand
7 Island
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Strip Mine
4 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland

The reasons I have 4 is because I don't have any other way to tutor for Grindstone since I'm not running black, and because of SoLoMoxen and toolbox it seems it would rarely be a bad draw. But if I was to cut one, what would you replace it with?

Start of edit
Updated decklist:

1 Mana Crypt
1 Sol Ring
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Echoing Truth
4 Force of Will
1 Hurkyl's Recall
4 Mana Drain
1 Mystical Tutor
2 Mental Misstep
1 Sensei’s Divining Top
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Brainstorm
1 Time Walk
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Painter’s Servant
3 Trinket Mage
2 Grindstone
1 Fire / Ice
4 Dark Confidant
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor

1 Flooded Strand
3 Island
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Misty Rainforest
2 Polluted Delta
2 Scalding Tarn
1 Strip Mine
3 Volcanic Island
3 Underground Sea
4 Wasteland

Sideboard:

2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Meekstone
1 Pithing Needle
1 Aether Spellbomb
4 Red Elemental Blast
3 Yixlid Jailer
2 Ingot Chewer
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
End of edit

I got advised to start a new thread for this deck in the Jace Control thread. I play in an unpowered/semi powered metagame. (That means no MUD, STAX, Gush, Tendrils). Most likely meta will be Oath, Tezz/Painter, Fish and Aggro (hatebears, goblins, affinity, vengevine stuff) and perhaps Bazaar less Dredge). I am tired of Oath (every powerless metagame’s powerhouse) and Zoo (really effective in this meta) and wanted to try something new. Here is my twist on a Jace control deck.

Jace the Painter

1 Lotus Petal
1 Sol Ring
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Echoing Truth
4 Force of Will
1 Hurkyl's Recall
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Mana Drain
1 Misdirection
1 Mystical Tutor
2 Mental Misstep
3 Preordain
1 Brainstorm
1 Time Walk
3 Red Elemental Blast
4 Painter’s Servant
4 Trinket Mage
2 Grindstone
1 Fire / Ice

1 Flooded Strand
7 Island
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Strip Mine
4 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland

A) I have cut the Standstill/Mishra’s Factory package because I’m not sure if it is the best choice in this meta.

B) I have chosen the painterpackage instead of the 4 Snapcaster Mage package. I don’t have the Snapcasters (yet) and I felt Trinket Mage toolbox could be good in my metagame along with a strong win condition.   

As you can see I don’t own Ancestral Recall or Black Lotus (yet).

For sideboard I am thinking something like this:

1 Tinker
1 Blightsteel Colossus
1 Sphinx of the Steel Wind
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Pithing Needle
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Aether Spellbomb
1 Meekstone
1 Firespout
4 Leyline of the Void

Please reply on my choices if you see something you would have done different.

Ok, thank you

So you wouldn't bother including the painter combo? (if I read your reply correct)

-4 Null Rod, -2 Steel Sabotage, -2 Mindbreak Trap, -1 Misdirection, -2 Spell Pierce
+4 Snapcaster Mage, +1 Fire / Ice (total 4 burn spells), +3 Mental Misstep, +3 Spell Snare

I don't think there is room for MD artifact/enchantment hate other than Hurkyl's Recall and Echoing Truth if I want to put in these cards. Don't know what to remove for Preordain and Brainstorm. Perhaps I could cut the Crucible of Worlds, Standstill, Mishra's Factory package. The deck will be completely different but I will have 6 more spots maindeck to play with and more stable manabase, easier to include Underground Sea for possible sideboard tech. Thanks for replying

I hope I'm not lowering the level of this thread by this post, but I wonder if some of you could help me to trim this deck to an unpowered meta. (That means no MUD, STAX, Gush, Tendrils). Most likely meta will be Oath, Tezz/Painter, Fish and Aggro (hatebears, goblins, affinity, vengevine stuff) and perhaps Bazaarless Dredge)

With this list from Josh Potucek as a shell:

1 Black Lotus
2 Crucible of Worlds
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
4 Null Rod
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Echoing Truth
4 Force of Will
1 Hurkyl's Recall
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Mana Drain
2 Mindbreak Trap
2 Misdirection
1 Mystical Tutor
2 Spell Pierce
4 Standstill
 2 Steel Sabotage
1 Time Walk
3 Lightning Bolt

1 Flooded Strand
3 Island
1 Library of Alexandria
4 Mishra's Factory
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Strip Mine
4 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland

I don't see much need for 4 Null Rod and 2 Steel Sabotage MD, 2 Mindbreak Trap is also a big questionmark. What 8 cards would you put into this deck instead to battle the above mentioned decks?

This deck has 2 Underground Sea in its sideboard so black mana is not a problem. LMK

Edit: What about
-4 Null Rod, -2 Steel Sabotage, -2 Mindbreak Trap, -1 Misdirection (-1 Crucible of Worlds, -1 Lightning Bolt)
+4 Painter’s Servant, +1(2) Grindstone, +4 Trinket Mage, +(1) Fire / Ice

This could:
A) Make REB/Pyroblast in the side a little bit stronger
B) Enable a 1cc toolbox in the side
C) Justify perhaps playing Tinker + robot.