Wait! End of your draw step! Mind Bomb...and Balance!

I like this card for sure, but I like a lot of terrible cards.  Not sayin this card is terrible, but I'll let other people try to figure out if it's worth playing seriously 

Echo Mage = Montel Williams

Just play a damn Angel's Grace or play a good deck. /thread

I have a feeling that you don't understand why a 5 mana permanent that requires additional resources is bad.  Do this: the next time your Future Sight resolves, think about how much better it would have been if it was a Tez (with Key/Vault ofc) while you try to find the mana to play the cards on the top of your library.
I'm trying to help and be polite at the same time.  If a friend in my group came to me with your list and suggestion I would laugh at him and ask what the hell is wrong with him.  The fact is, there's no way to sound completely honest and polite at the same time, because you're the person who is just SO SURE that his idea is good so you will ignore the really good advice.
 Well I didn't say it doesn't work.  I know it can work (by work I mean goldfish a victory).  I'm saying it's not good enough for competitive vintage.
I didn't misinterpret it at all.  I was trying to get you to see the real issue here: a resolved Bargain doesn't need shitty life gain spells to win.  If you need life gain with Bargain, your deck sucks.  Period.
 
Sorry for trying to help!  Have fun ignoring advice from players - and trust me, the best advice you'll get is what I've been trying to say.
I reply to things that are wrong/awful and try to help out.  So maybe you're right.
Yeah but...they were right.

First,
I did ask for a list.
You play 4 FoW, 4 Drain, Spell Pierce and even Twincast can function as a counterspell.  If you want more protection, at least play more blue or black cards (Duress) so that you don't have to ruin your mana base.  Rainbow lands, only 3 Fetches, and only one (!) basic is just an awful mana base.
Welcome to The Mana Drain.  Asking about a life gain card to help fuel Bargain/Necro is going to end with some serious criticism (be glad I got here before Soly or someone else).  This strategy just isn't going to work in a competitive environment.  Just look at Future Sight - it costs 2UUU and isn't a win condition.  Even Dream Halls is probably better, Tez even more so.  I stand by what I said: if you see 60% of your deck and don't win with Tendrils, either you did something wrong or your opponent did something right.  In either case, some very narrow white life gain spell shouldn't be the fix you're looking for.

Bargain is the gun.  Lousy life gain spells are the shiny handle the gun doesn't need to kill things.

Get better with the deck or make it better (like removing Future Sight and Silence).

If you see 60% of your deck and still can't kill with a Tendrils, then you're doing something wrong.  Filling it with cards that gain life will mean you have more cards that don't find your win conditions.

In any case, post your deck list.

You can't Tinker in a Bargain with Lattice in play.  Bargain would be colorless while it's in your library, but it wouldn't be an artifact.

I'm gonna agree with smasher for now.  I've used the same list as the OP against a Shops deck with a million lock pieces + Sculpting Steel + Smokestack.  I've found that Duress and even Thoughtseize don't do enough against that deck - you can hit a good piece in their hand, but with that kind of lock piece-density it doesn't matter much.  [As an aside, it seems like people in the Shops thread haven't been playing with Smokestack+Scultping in a not-so-aggressive Shop deck.  Well, they should  ]

What really makes things difficult is damn Lodestone Golem.  I know that this thread is basically about this card, but I haven't felt that these changes to GWSx have helped as much as they need to.  Without the Golem it's possible to slowroll the EOT Hurks/Rebuild as you build a mana base, but the Golem says "You have this many turns to get your bounce spell" while they find more lock pieces.  If a Smokestack hits at that point it's just game over.  Many many times I have felt like even Hurkyl's cost too much mana!  Throw Chalice in there and....ugh.  Pro play of the day was play Chalice at 1, copy with Sculpting Steel 

I think the only games I have won were when Golem never hit, or if I drew exceptionally well.  If I played against something like the list hitman posted I'm sure I'd have much more success.  I'm not going to completely give up with this list, as I've had success with GWSx in the past, and I love rolling over Tez and some fish decks.

Even if it does work, this guy still doesn't stop Vault/Key, because, well, your opponent won't let you get this guy to level 9000 before they combo out.

Sharpie + crap cards

I've tried playing Top in TPS and I think it's a great card in there.  Unfortunately I was never able to cut a card for it, so it became card #61.  I know that's not ideal but I haven't been playing much lately so I haven't had a lot of testing .  I've always thought that GT or FoF would be the card to go and I have to agree that FoF offers something the deck sometimes really needs (at least more often than what GT usually offers).  My favorite play with Top was getting it along with a topdeck tutor off an otherwise lousy Desire, but got there thanks to Top both drawing the card and giving me an exactly lethal storm count.

I know these guys in the video.  We always give him crap for opening a Lace

At the time he was building a Beta set, so it was all good for him.

I was the TPS player and we only played a few games (four or five?).  I either won very explosively and early against his seemingly mediocre draws or I kept somewhat marginally playable hands (which I probably should have mulled) and got my hand picked apart with Duress/FoW/Drain.  I don't know if it's fair at this point to make any judgments regarding this matchup.

This deck doesn't play Vault/Key for the same reasons the modern Grow deck doesn't play the combo.  Smasher probably wouldn't like to ever draw Key or Vault since they don't do anything by themselves, as opposed to every card currently in the deck.  Billions of Duresses backed by a fast clock and overwhelming advantage is something to be afraid of. 

He surely could fit the combo in at the sacrifice of some disruption, but at that point you're going to want to put in Tinker and possibly Gifts, and Yawg Will, and then maybe a Tezz...and the deck really just becomes your normal Tezz deck.  That may be a bit of a stretch, but in any case, this deck with Vault/Key would look unfocused and pretty bad.  As it is- sure it could be improved - it has been pretty impressive in the little bit of testing we've done. 

I can't stand these sleeves.  They feel cheap and break often.  They're also very annoying to shuffle - I can't really describe the feel, it's just awful for me.

KMC 100ct. packs, however, have been nothing short of amazing for me.  They're the most consistent I've used, quality-wise, and they last long enough.
If you get a good pack of Dragonshields, though, they are IMO the best sleeves period.  It's too bad most of the time the sleeves are horribly miscut or have awfully frayed edges, making them pretty much unplayable.

I never split KMC 100ct. (don't get me started on 80ct. packs) or Dragonshields.  I don't know what you guys are doing that makes these things split.  The Magic ones split because they're just low quality - consistently, in my experience.

As for stiffest sleeves, I have yet to try The Hardest Sleeves, or whatever they are called.  I think nikofromtokyo sells them..?

Obviously he's a cheater because there's no way the list is wrong.



Anyway, great event as always!  I'll be at the next one.

Engineered Plague - you can even bring it in against Tezz and name Wizard to kill their Bobs!  And Aven Mindcensor! and Balduvian Frostwalker

I'm going to honestly critique your choices.  I am not intending to flame.

Helix Pinnacle is an awful win condition.  Since it triggers on your upkeep, you need to a lot of things:
-combo out*
-get the Pinnacle
-pass turn and get to your next upkeep.

*by "combo out," apparently you are trying to use Mirror+Channel as a draw engine.  So you need to Channel into Mirror, then kill yourself several times - but each time, you need Mirror in play.  So to get the mana to feed Pinnacle, you will need to do this at least several times...in a green-heavy deck.  I find it hard to believe that you can even think that this has potential.  You know that in the same exact deck you could just replace Channel and Mirror with Vault and Key and win much more efficiently? (I'm not suggesting this, but it's true since you *need* both Channel and Mirror, and both do nothing by themselves [Sure Channel can, but good luck making good use of it]  Also, I think Mirror/Channel in addition to Vault/Key can be interesting. See below).

Rocket Launcher blows since it basically has summoning sickness.  Goblin Cannon and Magma Mine are what you want instead.

Hurricane is awful as well.  You'll need to Mirror into it with mana floating from a previous Mirror.  This path to victory is just too complicated, situational and uses too many dead cards.

I've only been impressed by a Mirror/Channel deck once, from this list http://www.morphling.de/top8decks.php?id=1142 , and guess what?  It has loads of tutors and protection.  And Vault/Key.  I'm not trying to flame you, I just seriously wonder what kind of environment you're playing in that would make you consider this deck (and other decks you've posted).  The most improvement/critique I can offer is simply this: realize the direction you're going in is doomed to be not competitive, and understand why I think this.

Standstill triggers whenever a spell is played.  On resolution, it is sacrificed, and the players draw cards.

Trickbind is no different than Stifle in this case.  With the Standstill trigger on the stack, player B plays Trickbind, targeting Standstill's trigger.  Standstill then triggers again, and it's the same case as with Stifle.  Standstill will resolve and it will be sacrificed and players will draw cards.  Then Trickbind resolves and counters the first Standstill trigger, but that doesn't matter because Standstill was already sacrificed (thus making the first trigger do nothing).

You are correct in assuming that player B's Stifle will cause the Standstill to trigger again.  The reason is the (very important) "if" clause in Standstill.  Only upon resolution of Standstill's trigger is it sacrificed, at which point the players draw cards.

Then the additional triggers will resolve (edit: if there are any - or they may be countered by Stifle, etc.), but won't do anything because Standstill isn't sacrificed.

So yeah, waste of a Stifle

Speaking of Jay and teabags...

GAYMER'S INN VINTAGE AGAIN, get ready for this man-filled spamfest!
To build some suspense let's consider all the wonderful things that might happen:

Will I play the same pile of crap I played at the last tournament where I went bye-2 drop?

Will my tire blow out again less than a mile from the shop after driving 50 miles?

Will someone finally deck check Ben to bust his ass for using 8 AKs and 8 Mana Leaks?

Will Jay EVER beat me?

Will the goblin pay his entry with nickels?

Will Damon die?

Be there to find out!

Nobody can be prepared for five Gargantuan Gorillas

Erase?  Really?  Do you think that card is good in Vintage right now (or ever)?  No, I don't think you should drop Visionary for Erase because you don't freaking need any enchantment hate!  Really, what's your deal with the enchantment hate?

Why keep it two colors?  Budget reasons?  If so, I'm not sure where you could go with the deck, but even still, three colors isn't out of the question.

Check out the Mountains Win Again thread in the Open forum.  I think some people had RGW builds, or maybe some RG.  You could start there.

Okay, let's say that's your goal.  Is Molten Frame optimal?  What about Angelic Curator?  What creatures do you expect to destroy/block with these cards?  I actually lol'd when I read Angelic Curator (yeah I had to look it up).  It's awful.

I like what your goal is.  I think targeting artifacts as a means to deny mana is a sound strategy.  And it helps that the best win condition in the format is a two artifact combo, so your mana-hate becomes doubly effective.  BUT...Ancient Grudge and Goblin Welder are both better than every card you've chosen.  You also don't really have much of a clock.  Goyf needs to be in here.  In order to be competitive you will probably need Null Rod.  It's that good right now.  RGW could be some sweet colors for this deck.

Also, what's up with your enchantment hate?  There's only one enchantment you would ever worry about - Oath - and it doesn't warrant as much hate as you've been packing, especially when your hate is as narrow as Visionary and Hedge-Mage.

No, that is not anywhere near being competitive.  In any format.  Ever.  I don't want to sound like a jackass, but you really cannot justify playing these AWFUL cards.  These cards are laughable, really, as no competitive deck would be afraid of them at all.

Take Molten Frame, for example.  Why is this card in your deck?  It can't kill Inkwell, Darksteel Colossus, OR Sphinx.  Are you that afraid of Juggernaut?
Why Soltary Visionary?  Your only target ever would be an Oath.  There are much better ways to combat Oath than a terrible, narrow creature.

Most of these cards are either straight up dead or just inferior to other choices.  I can't even make any suggestions because I don't understand at all what you are trying to do with this deck.

I still don't think it's viable.  It can be good against a Tezz player who plays Vault early, but they probably shouldn't do that to begin with.  So sure, it's good against a bad player.  We shouldn't play cards for that reason.

Contemplating her next move.  Don't punt this one, too.

Bob Tendrils is probably what I'd play if I could go   Champs like me don't need FoW or Drain.

Also, my prediction for top 8:
Not Jay Webb.

I top 8'd with a Painter+Time Vault deck a while back.  The only game I was glad I had both combos was when my opponent played Needle naming Vault and I won the next turn with Grindstone.
I then removed the Painters and built a Slaver deck with Vault (I didn't want to play Tez) and was much more pleased with it.

I think playing Vault in Painter is just bad and you'd be much better off with playing a straight-up Painter deck (unless you want to just play Tez of course).  If you did do that, your deck could slim down quite a bit:
-Top/Lotus Petal
-Trinket Mage
-Time Vault
-Voltaic Key
-Echoing Truth
I think these would need to go rather than the flavor calls you've made (Repeal, Shaman, the fourth Painter, Lotus Petal)

+Hurkyl's Recall
+Grindstone
+Fact or Fiction
+Mana Drain
+Misdirection/Repeal (I like this one!)/Rack and Ruin/Pyroblast/Engineered Explosives/Library/something

I think the biggest problem with the Painter/Vault hybrid is that you know the Vault combo is just easier to assemble, which will skew your choices when tutoring and what kind of hands to keep.  So you'll end up with what feels like a Painter+Red Blast package in a Tezzeret-less Vault deck which is just fucking awkward.