Suggested by Myself, and asked by quite a few. I have Dec...

[BreathWeapon]

FoW just ain't cutting it as far as i'm concerned. Its "nifty," but i'm not sure its worth running for a few reasons. 1st, its hard to support with only 13-14 Blue cards. Second, its only useful vs Combo ... which is now U/B/g Dragon, Spoils Dragon, TPS and Spoils-Mask ... all of which either support FoW with a larger compliment of Blue spells and Duress. Playing the counter game just doesn't seem wise.

If anybody has found otherwise, i'm all ears.

I have indeed already tested stacker a great deal, and it is a very strong deck. My list is different than Vegeta's, but heavily influenced by his ideas nonetheless.

Stacker (Damage Lock Variant)

Critters (12)
4xJuggernaut
4xSu-Chi
4xGoblin Welder

Lock (12)
4xAnkh
4xPyrostatic Pillar
4xChalice of the Void

Secondary Kill/Finisher (8)
4xGoblin Charbelcher
4xShrapnel Blast

Mana (28)
1xStrip Mine
4xWasteland
1xTolarian Academy
4xMishra's Workshop
9xMountain
7xSoLoMoxen
1xMana Vault
1xMana Crypt

Sligh on Crack, thats all I have to say on the matter. I'm not a fan of Bloodmoon and Mind's Eye, I prefer the PUT IT IN THEIR MOUTH strategy

[BaronSengir]

About the Aggro-Workshop deck, you COULD try my deadbolt. I actually would appreciate if a couple of you would grab the list at first post, and if you have time or nothing to do, jack it up online for a few games and see how it plays. I do some playtesting, buts it getting hard with all the work piling on.

about the B/R Aggro-Workshop, I think a Masknought combined with arti-prison would work nicely. I threw togethor a list in a VERY small amount of time, to show you what it could possibly look like, although I really doubt Mind's Eye. Maybe spoils, but it has bad synergy with Workshop

Mana base needs work too, but the general idea should be there.

Sphere and Chalice have good synergy as locks because Mask will get under sphere, workshop can always play around sphere anyways and chalice is still powerful all around.

[Vegeta2711]

Ah the 'ol blow the fuck out of them strategy. Good times, good times. Quick question how's Charbelcher been for you? I used to run a lot of them, but the inconsistency has seemed to bite people enough in the ass (myself included) to cut them down from 4 or entirely from the deck.

Personally I am really liking Mind's Eye right now, but if I had another 2 slots I'd probably add Charblecher back in as a 2 of. ^^

Ugh, if you bother running the Mask Combo in artifact builds, run it in TnT. A stripped down TnT engine + Mask combo + Bazaar Engine w/ 4 Squee's, it posted some decent results back in the day. Basically it makes the deck with as much built in synergy as possible (So the diff deck engines don't fall apart) and 2 different draw engines to support it.

Though slightly inconsistent (less than you'd think though) and VERY vunerable to land hate, it smashes aggro of every form and does ok against control when it's working right. Sadly it COMPLETELY rolls to combo and stick w/ Plow and counters own it just the same. Not to mention the cost of 4 Bazaar, Lotus/Moxen, Workshop and Masks all in the same deck.  

[Haksaw]

So, first post, I've tried to follow through the various decklists and conversations...I was hoping for some input on the following.

The initial WelderMUD primer misses out on the Chalice of the Void, and it's been quoted as a lock condition for most of the Workshop decks it's included in.  Obviously, the card's power comes from early drop, most often for 1 or 2.  With that being the case, doesn't it tend to interfere with some of the simpler combo pieces?  Sphere of Resistance, Powder Keg, Goblin Welder seem to be significant.  It sounds like the deck is focussing on long term attrition, when it reality, the sooner that combo locks, the more likely you won't see a Worldgorger Dragon into Stroke of Genius.

Secondly, Mind's Eye has seemed to completely displaced Grafted Skullcap...granted, your hand isn't full at the end of turn, but there seems to be an inherent reactive drawback to Mind's Eye...it sucks up one mana (and again, you've got no reactive spells...you can't play that card until your turn, why not take advantage of the one-sided Howling Mine?)

Lastly, was it decided that the Winter Orb just slowed down the deck too much?  In my experience, untapping Mishra's Workshop and dropping a combo piece is not a bad thing...especially if you put the Metalworker out first turn.

Once again, this is a Montana player here...our metagame might just be behind the times...but the only viable inclusion of Chalice of the Void would be to stop the Berserk, or to spend the 6 mana and get Psycatog himself.  But I still think the lock and slowdown is more the advantage of Workshop decks than any form of beatdown...TNT's the deck I started with, and Dragon, Gro-a-tog and Hulk Smash have pretty much put the Su-chi's on the shelf.

[BreathWeapon]

@Haksaw

You'll probably want to look at other threads for these answers, but i'll try to some up the major changes.

Chalice of the Voild is the best card EVAR in Artifact Prison. You can drop it at 0 as a form of Mana Denial. You can drop at 1 to hinder your opponents early development with cards like Brainstorm and Duress etc. You can drop it at 2 to destroy almost any traditional Control deck. wMUD is used to running under symmetrical lock components, and can decide to "lift" the Chalice Lock at any time it deems fit by Welding it out of play or detonating it with Karn.

Mind's Eye is just better than Sh!t Cap. Hurkyl's Recall was a free win for 1U. Mind's Eye avoids this hate, generates at a minimum the same amount of card advantage for negligible cost differences and acts as a detterent against the opponents card manipulation ... Brainstorm = You Ancestral. On top of that, you get to keep a hand. This is important, as it now allows you to play REB in your SB making you much stronger vs Hurkyl's and Energy Flux.

Keg was dropped because Chalice does everything Keg did against Aggro but better. Winter Orb was an insignificant choice with Long in the Meta, it wasn't fast enough or even remotely useful, but it may now need to be re-evaluated given the resurgence of Control.

@ Everybody

wOrb is undoubtably a worthy point of discussion. Where does wOrb fit into classical wMUD and Neo-Prison decks? Deabolt is an obvious no, but other than that its not so clear

@ Vegeta

I live with Belchers inconsistant ways, it really hasn't had a "Bad Day" for me ... and I have gone "Oops I win" often enough with 1 Activation. I just thought Mind's Eye didn't fit the shceme of the deck, and Belcher did. Both cards give a long term plan to the deck, and Belcher is also a more immediate threat. Mind's Eye only really came into play vs Control players that were under the damage lock ... so I was looking for a kill card more than a draw Engine under these circumstances.

If I was going to go back to Sphere of Resistance over Ankh, looking to slow the game down, i'd probably run the Mind's Eye over the Belcher because a monotinous playstyle would be more fitting for the deck. Sadly tho', Sphere of Resistance has pretty crappy synergy with MD and SB Bloodmoon's, which I want to keep in mind given the current meta.

So in short, the only thing I would cut Belchers for are Bloodmoon's. 2/2 is pretty promising, but i'll go ballz to the wall for now  

Bazaar+Workshop+Mask=OMFG BEST DECK EVAR

@ Baron, I think you'll have a hard time selling a Workshop version of Mask when Spoils-Mask and U/R Spoils-Mask wrecking house as is. Unmask/Hymn/Duress is just better than CotV and Sphere. If I wanted to play a deck with a long term outlook on Mask, i'd run Vengeur Masque. I'm not saying your idea is unplayable, but i'm not sure you could convince Mask players to drop another half a grand for Workshops \n\n

[BaronSengir]

No no no, I just plopped up a super rough decklist cause I read somewhere about a idea about a B/R hybrid Aggro-Workshop (similiar to Deadbolt and in some cases Stacker), so when I think of aggro + black = mask (in most cases). I just threw togethor what would probably look like a "typical" core so that if interest was sparked, we could work on it. Most likely, it floundered, but thats what happens to ideas.

about bazaar + workshop + mask: probably could be broken. But I don't feel like wranging up another decklist. Perhaps the Bazaar MUD that Game Boy is making up may be what we are looking for, except it lacks another 8 card combo (4 mask, 4 nought) which is hard to squeeze in under a bazaar combo (8 cards again) and in combination with that, fit in a control piece.

@Haksaw: About Mind's Eye, Id say Breathweapon pretty much summed it up. You will always have free mana open with MUD, or its varients, simply because they abuse Metalworker so much. I find myself usually with a metalworker tapped, a workshop (maybe, or a few mox) and a ton of pernaments on the table while I still have around 3-5 mana to chuck around. Thats already plenty of card advantage. Not to mention the garaunteed draw on your opponents turn when his default draw triggers.

Also: when you plunk down a Mind's Eye, the drawing opponent suddenly becomes very cautious. Whereas he has been casting draw galore, any cheap, effective draw spell he has cast just turned into huge card advantage for you. To sum it up, it basically means more cards for you, less for them, and that = very good.

@Breath: about your versions, I noticed that they are actually very stripped down. Not in that sense, but more like theres more 4 ofs than anything else, instead of spreading a little here and a little there, which may or may not be a good thing. However, I don't think you might need 4 shrapnel blasts. Try cutting one for "The Vise Age" ()

again, if anyone has time (just reasking cause no acknowledgement yet) could they just grab the Deadbolt list from first post and jack into appr for a couple games when they have time/nothing to do? I know it works pretty well for me, but I'd like to see how it works out with you, how you play it, etc etc.

[Vegeta2711]

Breath: Just for general note, originally the one thing Stacker always lacked was a draw engine.    

Though your version by far it the most aggro oriented I've seen so far and your not even running fast pants in the deck. So for that strategy I can see endorsing your build, hehe. Except add a Vise, that bastard just wins games no matter what locks you play him with.

baron: If I have some time this weekend (working on term paper) I'll give Deadbolt a decent runthrough. And if not sometime this week.

I actually have a fun version built of 'The Most Expensive Aggo Deck EVAR'. (TnT, Mask, Bazaar)\n\n

[rozetta]

I'd imagine Mind's Eye is good against:

a) control (since they always run cantrips, etc)
b) dragon - own their bazaar
c) mirror - imagine a mind's eye on each side of the table

But against aggro and maybe other combo, I imagine it'll be less useful, since aggo doesn't draw cards and combo probably wins before you get to abuse the mind's eye.

I was wondering if it'd be a good choice as a sideboard card for slavery. I tested it in slavery, but it was too slow. In the 3 or 4 games I cast it, I drew at most 1 card off it.


As far as the questions about Future Sight, I think it's only viable in a deck running gilded lotuses, since otherwise it will be too difficult to cast. However, it has been incredible in those decks (as usual).

[Haksaw]

I guess my main argument again Mind's Eye lies in single card strategies, like Null Rod...if that bitch hits, you're only real option is to waste a Welder on your opponent, assuming they've got something in the graveyard...

Which actually builds a decent case against a Chalice of the Void for 1, not only preventing your Goblin Welder and Sphere of Resistance, but providing a self-lock when your opponent plays Null Rod.  Karn's a big teddy bear, but without his activation ability, your opponent can provide the Mox power,  and eventually that Psycatog is going to dance for 28.

A little rules clarification, (or at least some help): Activation cost, which is listed before the colon in the card’s text, includes tapping, correct?  Wouldn't that similarly make Null Rod a strong Metalworker disabler?  The simple solution seems to be to just play the Goblin Welder first, and it sounds like the proper play of a Chalice will have to be for 2 after sideboarding: Null Rod, Hurkyl's Recall, Animate Dead, Mana Drain, not to mention you need that Sphere of Resistance to slow down the Dragon.  Even with that, our current metagame has already started to change around the Chalice for 2, with 1 Rebuild in side for emergency Cunning Wish bait in Hulk or Dragon.

I'd like to hear some further discussion on Winter Orb also, I think Team Mean Deck mentions the synergy with Tangle Wire...I believe leads to a more guaranteed condition of mana advantage.  Yet again, a Chalice conflict is dipping it's little finger in.  

Chalice IS the primary Force of Will bait, don't get me wrong.  It gains board control by denying your opponents access to the board, but that door swings both ways.  I think that the art of controlling what is in play is the key to WelderMUD's success, but that requires being able to set it up, and then protect it from the Hurkyl's...  In other words, this deck's current build has NO conflicts with a Chalice set at 2, and I personally think that constitutes its inclusion and Winter Orb's head on the block.

[BaronSengir]

Although chalice certainly does hose parts of your deck as well, properly played, you can hose a bigger part of your opponents deck if you know what you want and what you want to "cut" from their deck

synergy with wire/wORB I used but instead utilised sORB to take advantage of wire, basically thats the type of lock that deadbolt uses: a sort of statis type lock

also, you can weld things back into played countered by chalice set @ 2. Play it like normal, get it countered, then weld. But this is very clunky and shuold only be a last resort. The good thing about artifact prison is that they have a big varying mana curve, so although chalice 0,1,2 hurts alot, it won't hurt so much as setting it down for 2 against control or 1 against hulk, sligh, etc etc

[BreathWeapon]

Baron, I see you use "Statis Lock" a lot. Do you meen Statis Lock as in Statis-Quo, or are you confusing this with Stasis?

Haksaw, Chalice isn't fighting for a space over wOrb. You can play them both and be fine. Yes, Null Rod is a SOB vs Workshop and using Mind's Eye over Skullcap gives them yet another target against it. Nevertheless, you can still try and out perm your opponent with Smokestack and force them to sack the Null Rod. Seeing as how this isn't very likely, a better idea might be to use 2xGorilla Shaman MD and do your best to scrape together 5 Mana to remove it from play. Also, you can use 2xJester's Skullcap and try to remove it pre-emptively from your opponents deck.

That said, Null Rod is just a good card vs wMUD anyway you look at it ... and even better vs Slavery.dec I think Loadstone Myr's ability gets around Null Rod, so Deadbolt would be the strongest Prison deck vs the Rod. Can somebody conforim that?

In conclusion, Null Rod hurtz and you'll need to side in your R&R's to deal with it.

Ofcourse, i'm an idiot and forgot all about Chalice for 2, which is the number you want to play vs Fish and Suicide anyway \n\n

[Sandster]

I think he means a Statis lock means everything tapped, which makes sense because Tangle Wire immediately taps the permanents that Static allows to untap.

[BreathWeapon]

@ Everybody,

Since Haksaw seems interested in the wOrb argument, and Null Rod is indeed a looming threat, perhaps its time to address the "Mystery 2x Slot" in full force? We never did touch on that in the last thread, and I think its about time we did.

[BaronSengir]

a 2x spot should probably go to artifact hosers, like mox monkey. Possibly slaver or trisk. What are you referring to as this "Mystery 2x spot?" A card that deserves 2 spots as utility, but doesn't really need a 4x of?

by statis lock I was referring to the Deadbolt lock pieces, e.g. sORB/tWIRE + Myr and Welder

about null rod: it reads
Players cannot play artifacts' activated abilities
Which hoses anything that a player can control over an artifact, except for continuous artifacts. It hoses all poly and mono artifacts (they did that wording in alpha, beta, unlimited) Poly is artifacts that don't tap to activate abilites (e.g. Mind's Eye) and Mono needs tap (e.g. Candelabra, Mox)

[shadowspawn]

Sorry, I haven't been posting for a while, I've had Christmas stuff to take care of along with late school nights. Anyways I'll get straight to the point.

Worb deserves to be discussed for the sole reason of it being very good vs Control. With the rising amount of control decks like Keeper and Neo-Gat, both of which are very strong in testing. If anyone cares to try Worb, I'd like to know the results.

At the moment I'm playing 2 Duplicant's in my mystery spot. Why? Duplicant is a serious house vs Dargon, A good beatstick against Reanimator/Hermit Druid decks and is quite useful in the Mask matchup. I'm running 3 Blood Moons sideboard along with 4 Crypt, RaR, Reb, I haven't found a better sideboard yet. A mystery slot is that last 2 slots of Welder Mud that no one has defined yet. There are alot of Mystery slots available, I preferably think Blood Moon, Serrated Arrows(instead of Trisk, because of the cost obviously), Duplicant, Null Brooch, Winter Orb, Mox Monkey. There's probably more, but I haven't looked through red and artifact cards for awhile   .

Rozetta, I tested your newest list of Bosh Senior, And I really liked it. Future sight>Mind's Eye in your deck. I made a few changes however. -2 Chalice, +2 Karn, -1 FoF(to have 60 cards). Karn is really good with Gilded Lotus becoming a 5/5 and MindSlaver Becoming a 6/6, It gives the deck a type of Aggro feel after destroying him with Slaver lock.

I'll have to try DeadBolt too, Along with Stacker 3( my own Version), Oh Veg, when you have the chance, mind posting the Bazaar-Mask-TnT build for fun?I remember seeing a thread on it A LONG time ago. And maybe it could be something funny to play with.

[BreathWeapon]

@ Vegeta

I'd love to run Black Vise, but I had to cut something for wastelands 3-4 and I figured the 1x of Vise and Jar could go.
Maybe I should drop a Shrapnel Blast or Charbelcher? Eh, I like all of my pretty 4x tho'  

@ Baron

I've already put soo much testing into Deadbolt as is. Our lists are pretty much identical so I can tell you for sure that it should still be a potent deck. Metagame wise its lost a bit in the absence of Long and the reinforced presence of Dragon, but thats true for wMUD as well.

@ Shadowspawn

So I take it Guilded Lotus for Future Sight is amply broken in Workshop.dec? I haven't had time to test it for myself yet, so i'm kind of eager to see what everybody else thinks.

@ Bazaar of Baghdad

I'll be damned before I put Bazaar of Baghdad in a Workshop deck, thats just decadent

[BuboniC]

Well im late on the van, but for a week I have been working on "Goblin Trix". Hereis the most current list(dont be fooled by the name):
4 Metal Worker
4 Goblin Welder
4 Tangle Wire
4 Smokestack
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Mindslaver
2 Powder Keg
2 Mind's Eye
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Triskelion
1 Karn, Silver Golem
1 Gorilla Shaman
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Memory Jar
1 Tinker
1 Ancestal Recal

4 Great Furnace
4 Glimmervoid
4 Mishra's Workshop
3 Volcanic Island
2 Polluted Delta
1 Badlands
1 Sol Ring
1 Tolarian Academy
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Mox Saphirre
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Jet

SB:
4 Tormod's Crypt
3 Fire/Ice
3 Rack and Ruin
2 Karn
2 Powder Keg
1 Triskelion

So far, from testing, the deck owns the other workshop decks(trust me- I know its surprising) but they cant handle all the locks. Sphere of resistance has too little function in the deck- the Kegs are for Fish. Im trying too make a "rogue" workshop deck. This also has the brokeness of Tinker, which I missed so much playing MUD. This deck also has much, much more card advantage, and engines than MUD does. I will test alot more, and the build will probably look nothing like this, at all   . Well the thing too look out for is my COW Pie.dec!!(Crucible of Worlds) It will be so broken+wasteland+never ending permanant sac+city of traitors, if anyone is interested I will give a decklist.

[Vegeta2711]

Here you have it. In all it's shiny break the back, OMG YOU MEERGED ATEH DEX0RZ, deck. I do not endorse this in anyway as being good, but a ton of fun.

//NAME: The Most Expensive Aggro Deck EVAR.
// Land
        1 Mana Crypt
        1 Mana Vault
        1 Grim Monolith
        1 Black Lotus
        1 Sol Ring
        1 Mox Emerald
        1 Mox Jet
        1 Mox Pearl
        1 Mox Sapphire
        1 Mox Ruby
        1 Mountain
        2 Forest
        4 Taiga
        4 Wooded Foothills
        4 Mishra's Workshop
// Core Draw
        4 Bazaar of Baghdad
        4 Squee, Goblin Nabob
// Core Combo
        4 Illusionary Mask
        4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
// Core B
        4 Survival of the Fittest
        4 Goblin Welder
        4 Juggernaut
        2 Su-Chi
// Random stuff
        4 Anger
        1 Memory Jar\n\n

[Toast]

Quote Mind's Eye is just better than Sh!t Cap. Hurkyl's Recall was a free win for 1U. Mind's Eye avoids this hate, generates at a minimum the same amount of card advantage for negligible cost differences and acts as a detterent against the opponents card manipulation ... Brainstorm = You Ancestral. On top of that, you get to keep a hand. This is important, as it now allows you to play REB in your SB making you much stronger vs Hurkyl's and Energy Flux.

I was just browsing through this thread and noticed this statement went fairly uncontested and wanted to present the other side of the case.

Mind's Eye is not clearly better than skullcap. In both cases you want to be dropping the card pretty late so the mana cost is negligable, what is not negligible is that you have to pay for your cards. This makes you slightly less explosive which is actually a big deal since you are trying to establish a hard lock also tying up your mana is not a good thing.

If you kept any half decent hand and are playing the deck properly, hate like hurkylls should be irrelevant. You establish a lock and then you drop a cap otherwise you are in a fairly bad position to begin with. similarly cards like REB aren't needed after the lock is in place so it is still very reasonable to run REB and Skullcap in the same deck.

I am not saying Mind's Eye is a bad choice but it is not the only good choice. I still prefer cap and I know many other people that feel the same. I wouldn't write off cap just yet.

[BaronSengir]

@ Bubonic: I think I see the general idea, being in slaving them and forcing themselves to screw their board over with wire / smokestack right? Then you got standard trix, and the artifact stuff to fuel metalworker. This deck seems to depend on metalworker (great furnace & glimmer void)

Also, its very risking running 8 artifact lands: with keeper, being a major contendor, mirror artifact decks, and any other deck splashing red that wants to deal with artifact-prison decks, they bring in the mox monkey. Turning it into a Land-D critter from Hell isn't that cool to watch.

Your deck seems that it only runs black for demonic tutor. That makes no sense. Also, running lots of 1x util critters seems random too, because you don't actually have a "fetch" card (except for tinker), or you have to rely on drawing with draw7,ancestral

and the other biggest thing I see is that absense of a dominating card early game. Smokestack only starts working after one turn. Wire can impede you early game. Both, thrown down early game and used aggresively, turn it into a game of Draw-Go. You have no way to seal the game within turns 1 or 2, except for chalice. That is why sphere factors in so nicely. And knowing at what to play chalice at is after you see their first turn land drop, spells, or after the first round in tournament. In the end, it boils down to losing your first game, or going second. Either one is a serious disadvantage to you.

Also, about not being able to handle locks: artifact prison decks were built to get around, and handle these cards so they could effectively turn them one way. In the early game where everything is crucial, and unless you drop trisk or something to handle their metalworker, they are going to dump equally as many threats on you.

and you also lack the last two off-colour moxen + lotus

I think the general idea is there but needs to tweak. (just like my Deadbolt)

My SB: For shadowspawn, Breathweapon, Vegeta (if you need it), if you want mine for Deadbolt (thanks for helping me test, and if anybody else wants to, that'll certainly be welcome   , find decklists @ first post and SB here)

SB, however probably needs alot of work and was made to deal with any myriad of decks that can be encountered on appr

SB:  4 Rack and Ruin
SB:  4 Red Elemental Blast
SB:  3 Tormod's Crypt
SB:  2 Null Brooch <- Can be replaced with Mogg Salvage for decks w/ blue that run pesky artifacts (Scept-Hulk, GAT, Keeper, Fish, Gay/R, Landstill, etc)
SB:  2 Jester's Cap

since I play on appr (I might buy some power, and proxy the workshops + lotus, and bring to tournament if it can win most on appr) I have to be prepared for pretty much any dominant T1 deck, other than rogues.


@breathweapon: is it ok if i use some of your posts from the Deadbolt thread? There are well written,  and can be used for "why play this deck over other prisons"

of course, you already get honorable mention as tri-creator, tester, contributor, etc.

[Corwin_of_Amber]

Quote SB:  4 Rack and Ruin
SB:  4 Red Elemental Blast
SB:  3 Tormod's Crypt
SB:  2 Null Brooch <- Can be replaced with Mogg Salvage for decks w/ blue that run pesky artifacts (Scept-Hulk, GAT, Keeper, Fish, Gay/R, Landstill, etc)
SB:  2 Jester's Cap

AHHH, the other part of the discussion that keeps getting forgotten... What is the correct Sideboard for WelderMUD?  Yes, sideboards are local-metagame dependant, but there should be a good baseline to work from.

Sideboard Choices:
Red Elemental Blast:  A good choice for MUD Decks vs. Control (Keeper, Tog, Fish)

Tormod's Crypt: Kills Dragon Decks, and rogue reanimators, and can be useful in the mirror?

Jester's Cap: An old favorite, and GREAT against most decks (Dragon - take the non-dragon critters or the dragons, Keeper - take morphling/decree/trenches/mox monkey, Tog - take togs & wishes, mirror - take karn + Welders)

Null Brooch: Emergency counterspell, and a way to put artifacts in the yard to Weld.  (I really don't like the Brooch)

Triskilion: Pinger / Alt. Win Condition. (Great in the mirror to kill opponent's Welders, vs. Sligh & Stompy)

Blood Moon: Traditional non-basic hoser (seems weak in the current meta, but can be good against Keeper/Tog)

Ensnaring Bridge: Only if running Skullcaps

Mindslaver / Time Vault: Pet "Trick" cards


But what else?
What are other good ideas for the SB?  Personally, I hate Null Brooch, but haven't found anything else to replace them with, yet I rarely, if ever, actually side them in.

[BreathWeapon]

wMUD sideboards are really simplistic,

4xRack and Ruin
4xREB
4xTormod's Crypt

Leaving you with 3 Metagame dependant or pet cards.

[rozetta]

Triskelions are definitely great against scrubby/aggro decks and the mirror. I almost always put one or two in my board.

I think Blood Moon is going to be a good card for the upcoming January Type 1 scene.

Talking of sideboarding, maybe we should also talk about how to sideboard in certain matchups - what comes in and more importantly what comes out.

[BuboniC]

Blood Moon=Best card in MUD Sideboard. My Sideboard looks like this:
4 REB(Energy Flux/Fish, Control)
3 Blood Moon(EVERYTHING!  )
3 Tormod's Crypt(Dragon/Mirror-might use 4 due too uprisin g of dragon
2 Powder Keg(Fish/Aggro)
1 Triskelion
1 Karn, Silver Golem
1 Mindslaver

[BreathWeapon]

Bloodmoon is only really good if the opponents manabase is n00bish or you have a Welder on the board. The moon is a weapon against Workshop, so it feels funny running it in my SB. I'm not saying its bad by any meens, but it feels like i'm punishing my opponent on account of his bad Manabase and SB preperation instead of dropping a BOMB.

[BaronSengir]

if we go according to breathweapons board, what 3 metagames calls? since i play on appr, i sort of had to "spread" out my SB a little bit

for the 3x mystery spot, i'd opt for jester's cap, possibly mogg salvage

[MuzzonoAmi]

On the matter of using Null Rod to shut Mind's Eye down:

Color= Artifact  Type= Artifact  Cost= 2 WL®  
Text (WL+errata): Players can't play artifacts' activated abilities. [Oracle 2000/02/01]

Does not affect continuous abilities or triggered abilities. [D'Angelo 1999/07/10]
Does affect mana source abilities of artifacts. [D'Angelo 1999/07/10]

Mind's Eye's ability is triggered, meaning that it isn't affected by Null Rod. Errata is tech.

[Kerzkid11]

Quote Bloodmoon is only really good if the opponents manabase is n00bish

Are you serious?

[shadowspawn]

Null Rod Doesn't Affect Mind's Eye, I thought more of you would know this :-/. BreathWeapon, Yes, The Gilded Lotus with Future Sight is working very well.

The sideboards displayed are pretty good, BreathWeapon said it best;

Quote wMUD sideboards are really simplistic,

4xRack and Ruin
4xREB
4xTormod's Crypt

Leaving you with 3 Metagame dependant or pet cards.

That's basically the sideboard most people run, I know MarkPharoah was running Pyrite SpellBomb's for Fish, Welders, Shaman's(I think) and only 3 Rack and Ruin's which is good because the meta he was in, wasn't calling for mass Artifact destruction. in the 3 metagame slots I'm running Blood Moons. Why? because Keeper is a real problem for Welder Mud, I'm not gonna give you stupid numbers bout the in percentages etc. but the matchup is something you should really be careful with. Also because Dragon is probably your second worst matchup, if not your first. I'm running a total of 9 cards for dragon and 7 for Keeper. Trust me, they deserve those slots. One thing I'd like to say is, Mogg Salvage isn't good, even if you're playing vs blue... what artifact are you going to kill that Welder, Rack and Ruin(after SB), Shaman(Good Mystery Card) can't handle? I'd like to say that Duplicant is VERY strong, it's removal and/or a beatstick, how can this not be good? Versus Dragon Duplicant is a house, especially with a Welder in play.

I have't playtested much lately because I got Starcraft working again   but the time I do get to test is giving me positive results. The only thing I'm wondering about is something Smmenen mentioned. The Tier 1 decks, or the gauntlet you should test against consists of Fish(either build), WelderMud/Stax, Keeper, Neo-Tog and Dragon, along with MaskNought and Slaver.dec as possible strong decks. How many matchups does Welder Mud have a bad matchup against. Almost half the fiield has a good matchup vs WelderMud, whether this is a problem or not, i'm not sure yet. WelderMud has always been strong, even with the hate today.

[BaronSengir]

Quote (shadowspawn @ Dec. 08 2003,18:40)The Tier 1 decks, or the gauntlet you should test against consists of Fish(either build), WelderMud/Stax, Keeper, Neo-Tog and Dragon, along with MaskNought and Slaver.dec as possible strong decks.

@SB:Fish, Keeper, Neo-tog, and Dragon, are matchups that are pesky, but namely you want to deal with Dragon, and the Silver-Bullet deck, a.k.a. keeper. Neo-tog and Fish shouldn't be too much of a problem, as they require maximum use of mana base (come to think of it, they all do) and anything you drop is serious impedement to their tempo. Thats why prison decks are strong. They have alternate ways to attain mana and don't wholy rely on lands to get their dumps.

So a sideboard, tuned to deal with all decks, would be
4 R&R (any pesky artifact)
4 REB (any blue based control)
4 Tormod's Crypt (hose tog, Dragon)
3 Jester's Cap (Jester's Cap, Mindslaver, Duplicant, and other utilities)

and to think of all those damn games I scooped when Wuzzyman plopped down a Null Rod..

DAMNIT! I though it screwed over everything, damn erratas, can't keep track of all this stuff.

So would null rod hose, say, Metalworker and Nullbrooch?