[Deck] Tropical Fish

[yespuhyren]

I started off playing around with the Fish deck, and it just couldn't find its balance, and I knew something had to be done.  

The deck was very strong, but the splash color didn't seem to be getting enough done for me.  I wasn't too keen on using fire/ice, and didn't play rack and ruin in the board either due to the fact I'm playing 4 Energy Flux.  

So I decided to remove the red, and stick in green to test it out.  This is the current decklist.

2x Island
4x Tropical Island
2x Faerie Conclave
1x Library of Alexandria
4x Wasteland
1x Strip Mine
2x Polluted Delta
2x Flooded Strand
4x Mishra's Factories EDITED from workshops...don't blame me, i used to play workshop decks

1x Mox Sapphire
1x Ancestral Recall
1x Time Walk
1x Regrowth
1x Fastbond
2x Crucible of Worlds
4x Curiosity
4x Standstill
4x Force of Will
3x Null Rod
2x Daze

4x Cloud of Faeries
4x Rootwater Thief
4x Spiketail Hatchling
4x Quirion Dryad

Sideboard:

2x Gaea's Blessing
4x Energy Flux
4x Suq'ata Firewalker
3x Stifle
2x Maze of Ith


Why I chose to play Green :

Quirion Dryad :  Great Card, and in a deck with very heavy blue and lots of little creatures coming into play, the dryad gets very big, and is very effective for smashing face under standstill.  It puts them on a much faster clock, and are usually forced to break the standstill earlier.

Regrowth :  Excellent card in general, and it is very useful recurring Time Walk, Ancestral, Standstill, or a creature when needed.

Fastbond :  Although some dislike the combo with a fetchland and Crucible, I personally think it is very useful.  For those who don't know, for every 2 life you pay, you can put a land into play untapped.  This card is great even without the combo, and it helps power out cloud of faeries and other great creatures.

SB Gaea's Blessing :  This is very helpful against dragon, and is a great card in general that helps in long draw-go games.  I have tested this to great results.


SB Choices

Maze of Ith : This card is very useful against other Fish decks and Workshop Fattie decks, as nothing you have can stop their big beats, let alone as fast as the Maze.  If it stays in play, it is very helpful.

Energy Flux:  This card has proven to be the most useful card in the sideboard, as where I play there are lots of artifact heavy decks, most containing Workshops or some form of Belcher deck.  This hurts them a lot if you can get one or two out early.  I wouldn't run less than four.

Stifle : This card is great for a lot of things, for instance in Type 1 it is often a one mana land destruction spell on a fetchland, but its not to be sideboarded in for that.  Its main function is against keeper, where the biggest threat is a cycled decree, as there is no way to counter that.

Suq'ata Firewalker:  This card is put in strictly against Fish decks, as fish is one of the most popular and played decks.  This can shut down their decks if it enters play, and there is little way for them to remove it due to the fact that their Grim Lavamancers can't target it, and neither can Fire/Ice

Odd Choice :

Rootwater Thief : I personally like the thief, and he was a recent addition to the deck, and has been a valuable asset to the deck.  It helps remove lots of potential threats that are in opponents deck rather quickly, and is most useful when removing one-of's from decks.  

For instance, I played against a slaver deck, removed 2 Mindslavers, on turn 2 and 3 (thanks to Fastbond for powering out turn 1 Thief with Curiosity).  

Then I went for Titan and Triskelion and he had few ways of winning after that, as his tinker couldn't find anything that useful.


I am hoping to get some statistics in for this deck, and I will do my best to get some up within the next week or so.

This deck has only been in existence for a few days, and I have played a few hours on Workstation with it, and it has been doing very well.  I am not claiming this deck to be better or worse than Fish, but it has proven to be very strong for me, and I hope to get in more playtesting.  I'm happy to get suggestions and feedback and change the deck up.

Jason

[skecreatoR]

You can play ONE card with your Workshop?

[PsychoCid]

Mishra's Workshop

I think you meant Mishra's Factory

[Plognark]

Hmm....kinda looks like wtf only you swapped out the river boas for dryads.
Rootwater thief is an interesting choice as well. He seems like a bit of a mana pit to me, but then, he's certainly got an effect worth sinking mana into. So many decks seem to be running bare minimum threats now that they could, perhaps, be more effective than they were in the past.

Standstill + dryad seems like non-synergy to me...perhaps running brainstorm would be better for the deck? Maybe up the fetch land count by 1 to take advantage of it?

[Raven Fire]

This deck has only been in existence for a few days,

Your version, maybe.  People (credit to Jacob) have been playing Green Fish (WTF) for about half a year now.

[Covetous]

I think I counted 62 cards in the MD with 23 mana.  No deck should be more than 60 cards to begin with, and I think that the general consensus is that 23 mana is too light even for a deck with the correct number of total cards.  Rootwater thief isn't as good as several other cards you could play--he's just too slow.  Quirion dryad + standstill = anti-synergy.  If you want to run dryads, run brainstorm instead.  Again, river boa is a very strong choice, and call of the herd is good as well.  You didn't come up with this deck, as has been pointed out already--you just made it worse.  Like an anti-Team Mean Deck.

[Jacob Orlove]

Here's the  original U/G thread, and here's the newer version that added red back in.

The only major update to the U/g/r version is that it now runs an Island and a Forest.

There should be some useful ideas for you in those threads.

[Razvan]

4 Fetchlands, 5 Strip Effects, 5 Colorless sources, and 2 come into play tapped blue sources. That leaves 7 hard blue mana sources and 4 green ones.

I think that mana denial decks will have a field day with this, unfortunately.

[yespuhyren]

What should I do to change the mana base.  Any thoughts on what to take out.

Covetous, I understand that I didn't invent it, but I did come up with it on my own as well.  I hadn't seen the G/U version that Jacob played until today when he posted on my thread.  So i apologize for not knowing all the random decks out there.  This is just posted here to get some advice.
  My apologies to Jacob if you thought I was trying to take credit for your deck.

The brainstorm idea is one I like a lot though, I'll try that

[yespuhyren]

Here is the newest version of the deck, after taking some advice from Jacob's deck.

2x Island
2x Forest
4x Tropical Island
2x Faerie Conclave
1x Library of Alexandria
4x Wasteland
1x Strip Mine
2x Polluted Delta
2x Wooded Foothills
4x Mishra's Factories
1x Mox Sapphire
1x Mox Emerald

1x Ancestral Recall
1x Time Walk
1x Regrowth
4x Curiosity
2x Sylvan Library
4x Force of Will
3x Null Rod
2x Impulse

4x Cloud of Faeries
4x Spiketail Hatchling
4x Quirion Dryad
4x River Boa

Sideboard:

2x Gaea's Blessing
4x Energy Flux
4x Suq'ata Firewalker
3x Stifle
2x Maze of Ith

[jCoKn]

:shock:  @ Future Sight?

 To have this in here makes me cringe thinknig about your mana curve. 5 is 2 more than your other highest cc (and no FOW is not a 5cc spell) ,and the 3 slot is generally restricted to crucible, and crucible only because of its massive game-swinging effect. Future sight is not enough bang for its buck, in an underpowered deck such as this. Especially when most your blue sources are huge wasteland targets anyway.

[JamesPr]

Couldn't Sylvan Libraries just as well be brainstorms?  They pump the Dryad unlike Sylvans.  Also aren't you noticing that 26 mana sources is too much?

[yespuhyren]

Actually, the mana has been working great.  Some changes I have made though.

2 future sight = 2 impulse
2 faerie conclave = delta, foothills

This deck has been doing pretty well, except the only problem I'm finding is that there isn't enough card draw.

I'm debating about using opt, sleight of hand, or deep analysis, or possibly going back to standstills and thiefs

Thoughts?

[Raven Fire]

Why run Impulse over Brainstorm (great synergy with fetch-lands) or Standstill (actually generates card advantage)?  SmemmenBlue runs Impulse because it wants to set a Chalice for 1, but I don't understand why you would want to use it in your deck.

[yespuhyren]

Brainstorm seems to get more redundant with sylvan library, as it already brainstorms automatically each turn.  I'm strongly feeling that I should remove the dryads, and put in 4 standstills and 4 rootwater theives.

I'm also thinking about adding ophidian for card draw if dryad stays in.  

Any other help is welcome.  I'm really hoping to turn this deck into something really powerful.

[JamesPr]

Here's what I would play R/U/G Fish.  This deck gives Fish a beater unlike in normal fish, so this build might actually be better than normal fish.  Quirion Dryad can grow big and has added synergy with Cloud of Faeries and Standstill.  Almost everything you play makes him bigger, and everything is a threat that you play.  I also took out Faerie Conclaves because they suck.

4x Quirion Dryad
4x Cloud of Faeries
4x Spiketail Hatchling
3x Grim Lavamancer
2x Gorilla Shaman

4x Force of Will
3x Daze
3x Null Rod

4x Standstill
4x Curiosity
1x Ancestral Recall
1x Time Walk

2x Crucible of Worlds

4x Fetch
4x Tropical Island
3x Volcanic Island
4x Mishra's Factory
4x Wasteland
1x Strip Mine
1x LOA

This is my own build and it's fast like normal fish, and Quirion Dryad is a house in it.

[mylkhead]

I play a URG version and I absolutely love Dryad+Standstill.  The last tournament I played at last Saturday, Dryad owned.  He was a 8/8 or higher in at least 3 or games at least a 5/5 in almost every other game.  The thing is you play dryad one turn, and then if you still have mana, play your other colored spells.  Next turn you play more colored spells and drop Standstill last.  Boom, you've got at worst a 2/2 Dryad if you didn't play ANY spells.  But trust me, he is a LOT better than most people think.  And so far, I would rather have him than River Boa simply because it's too hard to keep a G open to regenerate.  Especially for multiple Boas.  I run 1 Boa and 3 Dryads.

[yespuhyren]

Here's some workstation testing I've been doing

Green Stompy ,    5-0 Nothing interesting here, wasn't much of a challenge.  5-0 against same guy

Food Chain Goblins,   2-0, He boarded against me (he'd seen my decklist here before so knew what I was playing).  I didn't board at all.  Easy matches.

SUI,  2-0 didn't see anything he boarded in during Game 2.  He got in turn 1 hippy and hurt me lots but I established control and won.

Keeper,   2 - 1, lost to a broken will in Game 2.  The two I won involved obscenely large dryads under standstill with spiketails and FOW as backup

Burninator,  2-1 lost Game 1, won games 2 and 3 where I sided in 4x Chill

R/G Beats,  8 - 2.  Twice I lost game 1, boarded in chills all 4 times.  2-0, 2-0, 2-1, 2-1 against 4 different players

Smennen Blue - 4-0 .  Null rod shut down moxes, and i took advantage quick with walk, regrowth, walk, and dryad got to be 4/4.  Took him out shortly after that.  Other games were large dryad beats

Workshop Deck - 4-2 Lost 1 game to broken hand, conceded turn 1.  Lost the other game to 2 platinum angels.

THIS DECK IS LOSING TO MONO WHITE WEENIE...what can i change?  Is it worth changing for weenie?

Now i'm not saying this deck beats all, and its possible that the opponents I played with were not very skilled players.

 They did make a few play errors, and they were definitely not as familiar with their decks as they should have been.  I am going to say that this deck is very good in the metagame, and lesser players have problems handling this deck.  i'm sure a better player would fare better.  It is very consitant though.

More advice is helpful always

EDIT : Now 2-4 against keeper.  Having tough time dealing with angels.

[mylkhead]

Strange, at the last tournament I was at my ONLY game loss was to Mono-White Weenie.  And a bad one at that.  No power or StP.  I owned face with a 13/13 dryad game one and the second game, he dropped a [card]Commander  Eesha[/card] and I was like wtf is that?  Didn't even reckognize it but I was like, oh jeez.  Haha.  

It was a 2/4 with protection from creatures.   And it flies.  I had like 3 1/1 Cloud of Faeries and Grim Lavamancer Out.  And I would have lost one a turn.  And he had out this crazy card that for every 3W you paid you could make a 1/1 Soldier token.  I think it was an enchantment.   So he kept pumping out these little 1/1s while he beat down for 10 turns with an unblockable - non untapping - (had some crazy enchantment that allowed his creatures not to tap when attacking).  

So I just watched as a bad mono-W weenie took it to the house.  Couldn't Fire it, Bolt it, Lavamancer it or anything.  But game 3 was much easier.  I also didn't see 1 dryad that game.  And it was funny, first game he pacified my Dryad and he just sat there are grew the whole game haha.

There is a 4cc control player in my meta.  It's always a good matchup when I play him.  It sucks watching turn 1 or 2 morphed angels hit the board.  But my best bet is to either Fire, Bolt, or Lavamancer the 2/2 before it becomes a 1/1 and keep killing his white mana sources with my Wastes/Strip (Crucible when I see it).  

I've also played against a version of TPS or something.   Not sure on the exact decklist, but the Tendrils deck is a rough matchup.  I've beaten it in a few games and lost a few.  It seems that you get like two or 3 turns to try to out tempo it.  Standstill is great in this though.  Wastelands too.  Standstill into FoW is always good.

[Raven Fire]

Strange, at the last tournament I was at my ONLY game loss was to Mono-White Weenie.

It's not strange at all.  Janky aggro usually gives aggro-control fits because it packs a lot more threats than you do and none of them are really worth countering (especially when Fish's counters cost a card or tempo).  Add in the fact that your hate cards (Null Rods and Wastelands) don't work and it's easy to see why you fall prey to decks like WW.  It's even worse if they play the super janky weenies like Longbow Archer, Deftblade Elite, Silver Knight, etc. that just match up perfectly against all of Fish's 1 toughness critters.
Now, as for yespuhyren's question about this: Don't change your deck to deal with WW.  Just win your first couple rounds and let the Combo decks, Workshop decks, etc. knock them out so you won't get paired with them in the Swiss (or T8).

[SpencerForHire]

RUN SLICE AND DICE!!!

Oh sorry.. No my actual question is how does aggro like WW ruin you and you own food chain goblins, I recomend playing against another person and seeing if your results vary.

[rozetta]

Hah! That WW thing it hilarious because it simply didn't occur to me. Man, that would have been massive fun to attend one of the fish-heavy summer tournaments with WW even though it has no feasable way of making it to the top 8. Kinda like the nuke truck of magic decks - take as many people as you can down with you.

[Gabethebabe]

Smennen Blue - 4-0 .  Null rod shut down moxes, and i took advantage quick with walk, regrowth, walk, and dryad got to be 4/4.  Took him out shortly after that.  Other games were large dryad beats

Smemennennen Blue? You mean the deck that is invulnerable against your Wastelands, has more counters, has nightmares for you like Propaganda, Back to Basics and Chalice? How the hell did you go 4-0 against that?

[yespuhyren]

Countered the morphling with FOW and hatchlings.  Getting a large dryad is something they simply can't stop.

[Plognark]

White weenie is, oddly, a son-of-a-bitch for most fish decks to deal with. When you analyze the cards they pack it it makes sense though. Silver knights (if they're packing them) can be really horrific.

I play a URG version and I absolutely love Dryad+Standstill. The last tournament I played at last Saturday, Dryad owned. He was a 8/8 or higher in at least 3 or games at least a 5/5 in almost every other game. The thing is you play dryad one turn, and then if you still have mana, play your other colored spells. Next turn you play more colored spells and drop Standstill last. Boom, you've got at worst a 2/2 Dryad if you didn't play ANY spells. But trust me, he is a LOT better than most people think. And so far, I would rather have him than River Boa simply because it's too hard to keep a G open to regenerate. Especially for multiple Boas. I run 1 Boa and 3 Dryads.

This argument for standstill > brainstorm in UG or UGR fish + dryad makes sense to me. You don't need to get the dryad all that big in this deck for it to be a beast, and I can imagine standstill would bait some counters at worst and make dryad get even bigger. I'm sold on it. Not that brainstorm is bad or anything, I just think from the discussion standstill will be better. Just don't f*** up and play it wrong  

[Razvan]

Countered the morphling with FOW and hatchlings.  Getting a large dryad is something they simply can't stop.

Dude... they will never ever ever fall to a Hatchling. They have Drains and Mana Leaks to support their counterbase, and their mana base is nigh untouchable.

The game isn't always about countering winning conditions.

Although I still think this deck is good vs. Mono-Blue.

[yespuhyren]

I wasted his wastes, and resolved null rod.  He couldn't do much mana wise, as he had 3 moxes and an island left in play

[Shikari]

Well..Brainstorms are not always worse than sylvan library as they are really good with fetchlands due to the fact that you'll get 3 new cards. Unlike the library where you'll draw mostly the same cards all over again.

The library costs 2 mana, where brainstorm only cost 1.

Also, brainstorm is an instant, which is quite important. As an added bonus, it's blue, which allows you to pump your dryads.

Brainstorm can also be a mana fixer if you start with a hand that has little lands.

[wuaffiliate]

There is absolutely no reason to play [card]Quirion Dryad[/card] over [card]River Boa[/card] here. It makes very little strategic sense to replace strong creature like [card]River Boa[/card] with a very fragile threat like [card]Quirion Dryad[/card].

[card]River Boa[/card] is more troublesome for control than [card]Quirion Dryad[/card] is in this deck. It's unblockable and extremely hard to remove. [card]Quirion Dryad[/card] can get fat, but very slowly and over an extended period of time, not to mention that it is extremely easy to remove. Remember that fish wants to draw a lot of card with curiosity vs control, [card]River Boa[/card] helps you accomplish this as well as being a strong threat vs aggro.

You do not want to drop a [card]Grim Lavamancer[/card], it's a huge first turn play in many matches, and you want to see multiples. Hes the strongest utility card in the deck right now, there is no logical reason to drop below four.

Aside from that, i believe those who want [card]Quirion Dryad[/card] in this deck need to test much more. There is absolutely no reason to replace some of the cards you people have.

[card]River Boa[/card]
[card]Quirion Dryad[/card]

[Thissa]

Quirion Dryad is interesting... hes a nice fattie, but I think we are overrating him. He doesn't really fit with the strategy of the deck, and can be taken out pretty easily. He doesn't have the evasion that River Boa does, and unlike the Boa can easily be bolted. After a few goldfishes and 1 match testing Dryad (I know its not enough) although he can get pretty big without too much trouble, a card like Call of the Herd might be better in that slot. Anyway, heres my current list for UG Fish:

4 Cloud of Faeries
4 Spiketail Hatchling
4 River Boa
2 Old Man of the Sea

4 Force of Will
2 Daze
2 Oxidize
4 Standstill
4 Curiosity
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
1 Crucible of Worlds
3 Null Rod

2 Island
4 Tropical Island
1 Yavi Coast
5 Fetchlands
5 Strips
1 Mox
4 Mishra's Factory
2 Faerie Conclave

SB:
2 Suq'Ata Firewalker
3 Energy Flux
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Stifle
2 Maze of Ith
3 Blue Elemental Blast
2 Naturalize

I've been messing around with the SB a bit... Naturalizes I'm testing out of paranoia vs MonoBlue and Oath. Stifles are back in because of combo, and I probably don't need that many Energy Fluxes...