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Author Topic: [Free Article] So Many Insane Plays --The Battle for the Best Deck in History  (Read 12727 times)
nineisnoone
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« Reply #60 on: December 01, 2009, 11:57:30 am »

Makes me nostalgic for the days of when Vintage drew me in with it's craziness.

They should re-vamp the Vintage format (or in the alternative just create a new one). 

Pre-season, EVERY CARD is unrestricted.  Of course, it's "pre-season" so it doesn't matter.  Once the regular season starts, a restricted list is posted. Generally as bare bones as possible. You can even let cards that get release during regular season get a free pass until the next one starts. It doesn't really matter whether it is "correct" or not.  Broken eras are going to exist anyways, and in this format there will be a seasonal rotation (or rather a seasonal reset) so it won't really be a problem.  In this way, the DCI can be more willing to "let things happen," since there would be a natural end to the inevitable problems anyways. Once the official season is over, the process starts again. 

The advantage would be that there will no longer be legacy restrictions.  Was it the right choice to restrict Fact or Fiction?  Maybe at that time.  Maybe it is still now.  But even if it was right then, and right now, it wouldn't be right for the same reasons.  A restriction is in theory forever, but the rationale for that restriction is not.  Metagames are seasonal, not just because they are forced to be through rotating sets, but just by the nature of their evolution and competition.
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TheShop
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« Reply #61 on: December 01, 2009, 08:12:48 pm »

Quote
I don't know why so many people are talking about "powerful decks battling it out" as if the brokenness of your deck can change the fact you lost the die roll.  Look how many of the games in Steve's testing were determined by the winner of the die roll.  Why would anybody want to play in that kind of environment?

In Vintage we will never be able to escape the fact that the winner of the die roll will have an advantage.  We can, however, curb it so that it's not so much of an overwhelming advantage.  It is why Flash and Trinisphere were restricted


One thing I thought of a long time ago (gush / flash era) that would have been interesting to see in the M10 changes to deal with broken first turns. Would be a rule stating "you can only play mana sources on your first turn."
It didn't happen, but a lot of the tempo in vintage isn't mana related, more it’s about resolving a tutor or card advantage card.
 While it would make Drains better, it would also make stuff like Hymn to Tourach and double Duress better (other stuff too). Kind of wish instead of dealing with specifics (problem cards) they would deal with the problem, the tempo of being on the play vs. draw.
I actually think if they took away that advantage we could all go back to play our favorite decks of old. And probably do terribly.
Needless to say this rule will not likely be implemented. We’ll still no doubt find other fun ways of winning first turn -Or virtually winning by resolving something useful.
Such is vintage.


A rule for mana sources only would strengthen drain.dec by helping the deck get mana sources to play the drain, help combo by eliminating disruption from their building phases early in the game...and really hurt prison by allowing decks to stabilize the board before lock components could come down.  Besides, whichever deck went first would have a better chance at going off or controlling the game on their turn 2.  Think about Tendrils variants not being pressed for time and being able to lay additional lands.  Also, instant-speed draw spells would be FAR better than before because you could drop your land + artifact mana and just play the draw spell at the end of the opponent's first turn (potentially starting your second turn with the ability to have 3-4 mana sources and 5-6 cards in hand...this is busted).
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median
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« Reply #62 on: December 01, 2009, 11:06:25 pm »

I do agree that my idea of just accelerants is not great. I just never enjoyed getting hit by a random a turn zero (often protected) flash, and I think that every deck having large amounts of ichorid hate in their sideboard can be considered a format warp.
I mentioned my old theory because I wanted to approach the concepts of the broken early game laterally. -Though it did lose most of its purpose when most of the cards it was meant to deal with were restricted.

I actually like Nineisnoone's idea of a season idea more though.

Quote
pre-season, EVERY CARD is unrestricted.  Of course, it's "pre-season" so it doesn't matter.  Once the regular season starts, a restricted list is posted. Generally as bare bones as possible. You can even let cards that get release during regular season get a free pass until the next one starts. It doesn't really matter whether it is "correct" or not.  Broken eras are going to exist anyways, and in this format there will be a seasonal rotation (or rather a seasonal reset) so it won't really be a problem.  In this way, the DCI can be more willing to "let things happen," since there would be a natural end to the inevitable problems anyways. Once the official season is over, the process starts again
.  

Most of the players I know play extended during the ptq season and occasionally legacy for grand prix. Giving vintage a season would work out well, because during the season I could see vintage getting some attention.
This could, if developed into more of an idea, be something good.
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He traded goats for artifacts, artifacts for cards, cards for life. In the end, he traded life for goats.
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