Ultimate Vintage Team 2010

[Will]

With all the voting going on for the Grudge Match II I was curious as to what a sort of Ultimage Vintage Team would look like for the entire United States.  Sorry in advance if I forgot anyone who feels they should be mentioned.  

[A3S0P_R0C]

anyone who doesnt vote LSV is obviously slow

[A3S0P_R0C]

and id like to fight them

[Juggernaut GO]

why not just add 10 more names to the list and have EVERY single player in the united states that plays vintage on the team.

[Womba]

why not just add 10 more names to the list and have EVERY single player in the united states that plays vintage on the team.

Pretty sure you would be adding more than 10 to the list......

[Iron_Chef]

why not just add 10 more names to the list and have EVERY single player in the united states that plays vintage on the team.

Since you commented, it's not like wmgazoo is proposing a 35 person team, it's the pool of theoretical members.  that said, i wish i remembered Lou Christopher when helping Will come up with this list.

[Will]

I figured it's much better to have more people than less which seems to be backed up by the fact that all but 3 people that I listed have already received votes. 

[LordHomerCat]

You could probably do to put James King on this list.  He is pretty much the best Oath pilot you will find.

[Prospero]

The vote is certainly interesting.  

If there's one thing that is shocking me right now, it's the near complete lack of support for Robert Vroman.  

Seriously?  Between Iona Oath and UbaStax, the man deserves some serious credit.  He's an awesome Shop pilot who has proven himself versatile with other decks.  I voted for him, and I'd like to see some more support for him.

As for the Forino's, I think that their general lack of posting on TMD has hindered their performance here.  Vinnie Forino is one of the best Magic players I've ever played with, and Raf Forino is the Godfather of Shops.  Roland is the all time 5C master, but given that he's retired, I understand the logic behind not voting for him.

EDIT: I should add that I was very glad to see that Rich and LSV have done as well as they have.  They deserve it.

[voltron00x]

I feel like the top 5 on this list should be LSV, Ochoa, Sperling, Owen, Shay, by a pretty large margin, although Brassman and Demars would at least be in the conversation.  I'd certainly set up a draft in that order.

[forcethewill]

i disregard this list due to the lack of ... me on it.  but not to detract from this I will prove why I should be on there instead of having to be voted on it

[Suicideking]

You could probably do to put James King on this list.  He is pretty much the best Oath pilot you will find.

Thanks Jimmy.  Ill make sure to vote for you.

[JACO]

This should be about who's had the best year in Vintage in the USA in 2010, not just random d00ds who are good. That's why these lists are usually worthless.

[Ten-Ten]

This should be about who's had the best year in Vintage in the USA in 2010, not just random d00ds who are good. That's why these lists are usually worthless.

Good point. I agree.

[Iron_Chef]

This should be about who's had the best year in Vintage in the USA in 2010, not just random d00ds who are good. That's why these lists are usually worthless.

So.. start a new thread with what you'd like to see?  Nobody is stopping you.

[ELD]

So.. start a new thread with what you'd like to see?  Nobody is stopping you.

+1

If it's about who's had the best year, that changes things radically.  I wouldn't even know where to begin?  Did Rich Shay do anything major this year?  He's an auto include for an All Star Team, but if you're just talking about this year, I don't think he's played much.  I wouldn't even know where to get the data on how any given person did this year. 

[voltron00x]

Well, your main source would be Morphling.de and as for Mr. Shay, he won with Elephant Oath in February, won a pre-lim at Gen Con, won a Legacy tournament, and won another vintage event with a maindeck Precon.  That's just what I know of, off the top of my head.

So, he didn't play much, but when he played, he did pretty well.   

How you gauge that performance against that of others to the extent that you determine anything meaningful, I have no idea.

[Rico Suave]

I didn't know what a Vintage Team is, so I did a quick Google Image search and found this:

http://www.sportsmemorabilia.com/files/cache/796/pittsburgh-steelers-reebok-vintage-team-slogan-steel-curtain-premium-t-shirt_7963447d94a7e80d5fffca9b89a2b2ce.jpg

After viewing this image, I was rather surprised that Mean Joe Greene was not on this list. 

[JACO]

This should be about who's had the best year in Vintage in the USA in 2010, not just random d00ds who are good. That's why these lists are usually worthless.

So.. start a new thread with what you'd like to see?  Nobody is stopping you.

Nah it's cool. You guys can continue to fellatiate people who don't even actively play Vintage, but have a name you're familiar with. That's probably more suitable than actually looking at results to see who has been playing and consistently placing in Top 8's in the US this year.

why not just add 10 more names to the list and have EVERY single player in the united states that plays vintage on the team.

This was funny. 

[Rico Suave]

You wouldn't know who is placing in Top 8's unless Iron Chef was telling you.  You might want to choose your words with a little more care.

[TheBrassMan]

Nah it's cool. You guys can continue to fellatiate people who don't even actively play Vintage, but have a name you're familiar with. That's probably more suitable than actually looking at results to see who has been playing and consistently placing in Top 8's in the US this year.

Woah there buddy.  This is the internet and all, so I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic... but are you trying to imply that fellatio isn't awesome?  Because that's just ridiculous.

[Will]

Nah it's cool. You guys can continue to fellatiate people who don't even actively play Vintage, but have a name you're familiar with. That's probably more suitable than actually looking at results to see who has been playing and consistently placing in Top 8's in the US this year.

 

So I looked through Morphling for this year and filtered my results and found a bit of a hole in your plan.  I filtered them to tournaments with 30 or more people because it really doesn't seem to be worth it to analyze when it is 5 rounds or less then cut to top 8 (IMO).  So the issue is that of the 22 tournaments in this criteria 8 were Philly Opens/ Blue Bells and 5 were NYSE Events meaning that almost 60% of the tournaments contained pretty much the same player pool.  To actually look who consistently Top8ed in the US in "relevant" tournaments would cut the group of players to pretty much the Philly/NY crowd since no other areas had more than 2 tournaments of 30 or more people in 2010.  

[Marske]

@Wmagzoo7,

USA Vintage Team?

I see what you did here! Not including us Euro's (because then you'd have a list with people that have actually played Vintage this year more then once ) *Just kidding you guys!*

why not just add 10 more names to the list and have EVERY single player in the united states that plays vintage on the team.

ROFL !! So True...

Enough of the friendly stabbing at you USA guys, I voted for Brassman, Rico Suave, Failtofind, Voltron00x, Mr Type 4, The Atog Lord, Prospero, Vin and Raff Forino... for various reasons, if you don't know who all these people are by TMD handle you're not spending enough time on TMD!

Nah it's cool. You guys can continue to fellatiate people who don't even actively play Vintage, but have a name you're familiar with. That's probably more suitable than actually looking at results to see who has been playing and consistently placing in Top 8's in the US this year.

Woah there buddy.  This is the internet and all, so I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic... but are you trying to imply that fellatio isn't awesome?  Because that's just ridiculous.

Depends on who's giving / receiving it!

[Mr. Type 4]

lists are fun, thanks for the votes guys.  I know I dont post much on here or pundit for a lot of things, but I love tournament level Vintage and play at every opportunity. 

More importanly, it makes me wish there was a reason to actually make a USA Vintage Team to face off with other countries like Japan and Europe(sic).  If it were IRL I think the only fair way to assemble such a team would be to play for it somehow.

After viewing this image, I was rather surprised that Mean Joe Greene was not on this list.

If Mean Joe Greene were on the list, I'd have def voted for him.   

[Tha Gunslinga]

Nah it's cool. You guys can continue to fellatiate people who don't even actively play Vintage

Fellate
From Latin fellātus (“sucked”), past participle of fellō (“suck”), from Proto-Indo-European *dhe- (“to suck, to suckle”).
Verb

to fellate (third-person singular simple present fellates, present participle fellating, simple past and past participle fellated)

   1. (transitive) To perform oral sex on a man.
   2. (transitive) To stimulate a penis using Jaco's mouth.
   3. (transitive, figuratively) To shame oneself as if performing fellatio.

[Grand Inquisitor]

Your favorite Vintage player sucks

[honestabe]

Your favorite Vintage player sucks

No no no.  Didn't your hear Jaco?

You're favorite Vintage player is getting sucked

[Iron_Chef]

This should be about who's had the best year in Vintage in the USA in 2010, not just random d00ds who are good. That's why these lists are usually worthless.

So.. start a new thread with what you'd like to see?  Nobody is stopping you.

Nah it's cool. You guys can continue to fellatiate people who don't even actively play Vintage, but have a name you're familiar with. That's probably more suitable than actually looking at results to see who has been playing and consistently placing in Top 8's in the US this year.

For the life of me I don't understand the hostility.  At first I thought maybe you're upset because Will and I didn't include you on the ballot or perhaps someone who you thought should be on there (I did try to include people from other areas of the country that put up consistent results) but I couldn't find a tournament in 2010 you Top 8'ed.  So that can't be it.  I'm curious, why do you insist this is stupid/that we're doing it wrong?

This should be about who's had the best year in Vintage in the USA in 2010, not just random d00ds who are good. That's why these lists are usually worthless.

And in case you were interested in starting a different poll for "who is doing the best in 2010" or w/e you wanted to do, here are some names (with data) to get you started on your own thread so you can stop trolling this one.  By the way, this is using morphling for any USA vintage tournament with at least 16 players.

Number of Top 8's in 2010   
Matt Elias   9
Jeff Huang   8
Jake Gans   7
Ben Carp   5
Brad Granberry   5
Jake Kempfer   5
Mark Hornung   5
Ryan Fischer   5
Ryan Forsberg   5
Ryan Glackin   5
Stephen Nowakowski   5
Ashok Chitturi   4
Chris Pikula   4
Dave Reitnauer   4
David Ochoa   4
Dominic DiFebo   4
Dylan Joliffe   4
Eric Campusano   4
Jeff Folinus   4
Jeff Neilson   4
Jerome Yanchick   4
Josh Potucek   4
Justin Kohler   4
Marcus Knox   4
Mike Solymossy   4
Ralph Parsinitz   4
Ryan Devine   4
Sam Berse   4

Average Finish when they Top 8 (minimum 2 Top 8's)

Allen Fulmer   1
Karl Kress   1
Sam Berse   1.25
Joe Brown   1.333333333
Nate Thompson   1.333333333
Brent Peterson   1.5
Jimmy McCarthy   1.5
Lin Cheng   1.5
Stephen Menendian   1.666666667
David Ochoa   1.75
Owen Turtenwald   2
Alex Owen   2
James King   2
Jeremy Beaver   2
Matteo Tarbet   2
Raffaele Forino   2.333333333
Carl Van Laethem   2.5
Dan Messineo   2.5
Marland Moore   2.5
Peter Ingram   2.5
Dylan Joliffe   2.5
Ashok Chitturi   2.75
Jake Gans   2.857142857

[KingSquee]

Number of Top 8's in 2010   
Matt Elias   9
Jeff Huang   8
Jake Gans   7
Ben Carp   5
Brad Granberry   5
Jake Kempfer   5
Mark Hornung   5
Ryan Fischer   5
Ryan Forsberg   5
Ryan Glackin   5
Stephen Nowakowski   5
Ashok Chitturi   4
Chris Pikula   4
Dave Reitnauer   4
David Ochoa   4
Dominic DiFebo   4
Dylan Joliffe   4
Eric Campusano   4
Jeff Folinus   4
Jeff Neilson   4
Jerome Yanchick   4
Josh Potucek   4
Justin Kohler   4
Marcus Knox   4
Mike Solymossy   4
Ralph Parsinitz   4
Ryan Devine   4
Sam Berse                  4

With 19 Top 8's spread amongst us, clearly 2010 is The Year of the Ryan. So any "Ultimate Vintage Team" must start with us 4. Just sayin'...

[JACO]

For the life of me I don't understand the hostility.  At first I thought maybe you're upset because Will and I didn't include you on the ballot or perhaps someone who you thought should be on there (I did try to include people from other areas of the country that put up consistent results) but I couldn't find a tournament in 2010 you Top 8'ed.  So that can't be it.  I'm curious, why do you insist this is stupid/that we're doing it wrong?

It's not about me because I don't play that much (and would never expect any votes), so there's no hostility at all my friend. I just think it's pretty dumb to have a USA team (even as a fun exercise that this would be) based on something other than results people have put up in 2010, which means they're actively playing. People like TK, LSV, Bob Maher and others are listed who played Vintage like once or twice this year. That's kind of dumb and a vote as currently constructed is basically just playing to name power and ignores what actually transpired in 2010. People like Jeff Huang (8 top 8's) and Jake Gans (7 top 8's) aren't even listed in the vote. You see where there's a disconnect?

And in case you were interested in starting a different poll for "who is doing the best in 2010" or w/e you wanted to do, here are some names (with data) to get you started on your own thread so you can stop trolling this one.  By the way, this is using morphling for any USA vintage tournament with at least 16 players.
Number of Top 8's in 2010   
Matt Elias   9
Jeff Huang   8
Jake Gans   7
Ben Carp   5
Brad Granberry   5
Jake Kempfer   5
Mark Hornung   5
Ryan Fischer   5
Ryan Forsberg   5
Ryan Glackin   5
Stephen Nowakowski   5
Ashok Chitturi   4
Chris Pikula   4
Dave Reitnauer   4
David Ochoa   4
Dominic DiFebo   4
Dylan Joliffe   4
Eric Campusano   4
Jeff Folinus   4
Jeff Neilson   4
Jerome Yanchick   4
Josh Potucek   4
Justin Kohler   4
Marcus Knox   4
Mike Solymossy   4
Ralph Parsinitz   4
Ryan Devine   4
Sam Berse   4

Average Finish when they Top 8 (minimum 2 Top 8's)
Allen Fulmer   1
Karl Kress   1
Sam Berse   1.25
Joe Brown   1.333333333
Nate Thompson   1.333333333
Brent Peterson   1.5
Jimmy McCarthy   1.5
Lin Cheng   1.5
Stephen Menendian   1.666666667
David Ochoa   1.75
Owen Turtenwald   2
Alex Owen   2
James King   2
Jeremy Beaver   2
Matteo Tarbet   2
Raffaele Forino   2.333333333
Carl Van Laethem   2.5
Dan Messineo   2.5
Marland Moore   2.5
Peter Ingram   2.5
Dylan Joliffe   2.5
Ashok Chitturi   2.75
Jake Gans   2.857142857

Awesome that you busted some numbers out. So for example when WotC holds Nationals tournaments annually and they have their top 3 finishers plus an alternate (4th place) represent the country, why not do something like that for this Vintage exercise, but base it on the results we have for tournaments since their will obviously be no Nationals? So people would have the numbers in front of them, and if they wanted to vote for say David Ochoa or Mike Solymossy for a slot (4 top 8s), maybe have a little explanation of why they vote for him instead of anybody higher.