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1  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Does MUC still need Back to Basics? on: January 23, 2006, 07:56:49 am
You are probably right when you say it's become less powerfull than it was before, but it can still rip up decks. But it won't be winning any major tournaments if that's what you meanĀ  Smile

What do you mean by that? Should a MUC deck run B2B main or SB when going to a tourney?
2  Eternal Formats / Creative / Does MUC still need Back to Basics? on: January 23, 2006, 07:07:45 am
Before Fetchlands were unleashed to the market B2B was able to handle even the toughest mult colored decks with ease at the cost of locking a couple of your lands too like Library or perhaps even a wasteland. The cost was small but the price was big indeed.
Now that everybody is using Fetchlands, most of the people have reduced the number of Duals, or even Painlands they play and tend to run 5-6 Fetchlands alond with additional basic lands.
That means that B2B has become nowdays even less powerfull than it was some while ago. Has it just become an annoying card with some minor potential to disrupt your opponent?
3  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Question regarding Aggro MUC build on: December 27, 2005, 07:37:00 am
Why run Mana Leak over Counterspell if you aren't playing Moxen?

Cause I run 6 nonbasic lands which provide only colorless mana and it happens many times that I cannot afford 2 blue mana during the first 2 turns. What do you think of my previous question regarding the number of Morphlings which is needed?
4  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Question regarding Aggro MUC build on: December 27, 2005, 06:06:28 am
Maybe a decklist with an explanation of the choices would be a good start. Just a thought.

But what I don't understand is why you would want to play Morphling on turn two? You aren't trying to race your opponent. You are trying to counter whatever strategy he has. How does tapping out to cast a mana-intensive creature early on in the game fit into that strategy?

Actually turn 2 was a matter of speech, I meant that Mana Vault could actually help you cast Morphling early like turn 3-4 without being tapped out, so you could still have mana open for counter and use it's abilities if necessary. I'll post you my decklist(No Moxen/Lotus):

Countermagic:
4 Force of Will
4 Force Spike
4 Mana Drain
4 Mana Leakl
1 Misdirection

Card Draw/Hand Optimizer:
4 Brainstorm
4 Impulse
4 Ophidian
1 Ancestral Recall

Control/Creatures:
3 Back to Basics
3 Powder Keg
2 Morphling


Mana Base:
1 Mana Vault
1 Sol Ring
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Strip Mine
4 Wasteland
4 Flooded Strand
12 Island

I just replaced an island with a Mana Vault for a chance to have an aggresive start and play Ophidians/Morphlings more quickly and at the same time leaving mana open. Since I've decided to run Morphlings my question would be if I should add another one cause of the Mana Vault?
5  Eternal Formats / Creative / Question regarding Aggro MUC build on: December 26, 2005, 11:24:18 pm
I was just wondering if I wish to play MUC a bit more aggresive, whether Mana Vault would be a good idea. A 2nd turn Morphling is always a good move that can win games. If I chose to run a Vault in addition to the existing Mana Base, should I add an additional Morphling just for the aggresive Vault start, or should I keep the regular 2 Morphling built?
6  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Mystical Tutor in Mono-Control on: December 23, 2005, 07:18:33 am
It gets tinker and ancestral. Depending on your build, that could be a good enough reason to deal with the disadvantage.

What if I don't run neither Tinker nor Ancestral?
7  Eternal Formats / Creative / Mystical Tutor in Mono-Control on: December 22, 2005, 10:24:31 pm
I know that Mystical Tutor is a really quality tutor which is usually used in order to find missing combo pieces and it creates a slight card-disadvantage in exchange for a card you need, but I was wondering if it's worth to run this card in a Mono-Blue Control deck.
I usually use it to search for some bounce spell or a Fact or Fiction or perhaps even a Force of Will, if I'm gonna tap out during my next turn and I want to have a free counterspell available.
What do you suggest, is this card any good in this kind of decks or not?
8  Vintage Community Discussion / Casual Forum / Help me build an unpowered but competative MUC. on: December 17, 2005, 03:38:01 pm
The deck is unpowered, so is my metagame and I recently bought my Mana Drains from a collector in Greece(70$ each). I want to built a nice MUC deck and I would appreciate some suggestions.
My meta is mostly aggro rogue stuff, nothing like combo decks, perhaps  some arifact based decks.

Countermagic:
4 Force of Will
4 Force Spike
4 Mana Drain
4 Counterspell
2 Misdirection

Card Draw/Utilities:
4 Brainstorm
4 Ophidian
1 Fact or Fiction

Control/Creatures:
3 Back to Basics
3 Powder Keg
2 Morphling
2 Old Man of the Sea

Mana Base:
1 Sol Ring
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Strip Mine
4 Wasteland
4 Flooded Strand
12 Island

Basically my questions would be:
1) Should I keep the Force Spikes since I cannot afford a 1st turn Mana Leak, plus Daze is for Fish decks that tap out on 1st turn. Spike even if terrible from mid-late game, is very efficient durig the first turns and its a reliable 1st turn counter.
2) Should I use Brainstorms or Impulses? I prefer Brainstorms cause they're faster and combined with fetchlands very good.
3) Perhaps if I was to run Impulses instead of Brainstorm, I would replace the Force Spikes with Chalice of the Void, but I'm not sure wether they are needed in an random unpowered enviroment and since I run spells like Old Man and Powder Kegs.
4) Is my Mana Base ok or should I add more blue mana sources?

Thank you for your help Smile
9  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 16, 2005, 10:40:49 am
Do you thing that the 4 Force Spikes should be replaced by something else? The deck needs a decent 1st turn counterspell and since we can exclude the 1st turn Mana Leak scenario, something has to be done.
While we all know that Daze is for decks that like to tap out turn 1 (like Fish, NOT muc), Force Spike doesn't seem like a bad idea to me, since I never have to tap out on 1st turn and Spike can counter anything during that turn, perhaps even later in the earlygame. Later on in mid-lategame it gets pitched to FoW/Misdirection so it will never be a dead card.

How about the use of Stroke of Genius? In a deck with 4 Mana Drains you can easily grab some extra cards without tapping out.
10  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 15, 2005, 10:44:18 am
As far as creature control, Vedalken Shackles is such a good card.  Too bad 'random aggro decks' tend to run things like Null Rod and artifact hate.  Your best bet is not to waste maindeck slots on cards that control creatures, and instead try a strategy that trumps aggro strategies altogether.

Since my meta is unpowered and most decks are aggro rogue why is it a bad idea to run only 2 cards that control creatures main? I prefer using Old Man since he's a decent creature that can attack or block and his ability is really awesome against many creatures. He isn't a dead card and don't forget that he can be pitched to either FoW or Misdirection in comparison to Shackles which can be really useless sometimes.
11  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 14, 2005, 01:26:05 pm
Props for playing Force Spike.  It's excellent.

But what's all this talk about Control Magic and Old Man?  For the same price, I hear that Vedalken Shackles is pretty freaking awesome.

I would consider cutting the Morphlings as well, since you're not playing Drains, but offhand I couldn't tell you what to replace them with.

Brainstorm is superior to Impusle because of the second mana requirement. In a format where the crucial turn is on average 1.5, the Impulse puts you behind on the race for virtual card advantage/card quality even though it digs one card deeper. I don't think the trade off one card deeper for one turn later is justifiable. I've tried playing Impulse for a while, but every time I draw it, I'd rather have drawn a brainstorm.

Regarding this, I don't actually think that his metagame has a critical turn of 1.5 since it's unpowered.  I personally think Impulse is better, but it's a personal thing.  I like Opt too, and I would play it over Brainstorm in this deck also, since in my experience 4 fetches isn't enough to make Brainstorm good.
Quote

Well, I prefer Force Spike to Daze since I get to counter a 1st turn spell and have 2 lands on turn 2 in order to cast Counterspell or Mana Drain. You cannot manage this with Daze, you'll be doomed to still have only land on turn 2 and thats something you  might regret.

I dislike Shackles, especially with all the artifact hate around, at least Old Man is a decent creature and it counts as an alternative winning condition.

I'm planning on getting some Drains later. so Morphling will stay. The problem is once I get my Drains, what counters should I remove? Since I don't run any moxen I can't get a 1st turn Mana Leak anyway, so perhaps I should cut the Mana Leaks.
12  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 13, 2005, 05:50:31 pm
As for Brainstorm, I simply have to disagree that it is better than Impulse for this particular deck, for reasons greater than Chalice for 1. Brainstorm is problematic when your opponent has a threat on the table, and you Brainstorm and see nothing but counters and land... cause guess what? Without that reshuffle you don't have an answer now and you're still not going to have an answer two turns from now. This isn't as much of a problem when your Brainstorm is likely to show you three cards that actually do three different things, all of which you may need to do over the next couple of turns.

Brainstorm is superior to Impusle because of the second mana requirement. In a format where the crucial turn is on average 1.5, the Impulse puts you behind on the race for virtual card advantage/card quality even though it digs one card deeper. I don't think the trade off one card deeper for one turn later is justifiable. I've tried playing Impulse for a while, but every time I draw it, I'd rather have drawn a brainstorm.
13  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 13, 2005, 08:17:42 am
If the environment is unpowered, why are you building Mono-U in the first place?

Because I always liked this deck, plus I have all the cards and unfortunatelly I don't have a single Dual.
14  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 13, 2005, 06:03:54 am
Would you run Chalice+Impulse in an totally unpowered enviroment with no really competative decks?
If there aren't any Moxen/Welders would Chalice still be a good choice?
Ok, there is lots of Aggro and Artifacts, but does it justify the presence of Chalice and therefore Impulse instead of the 1cc Brainstorm?
15  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 12, 2005, 12:45:15 pm
What sort of meta are you working for?  If you're working on Mono-U, I'd start with Ben Kowal's last list from the dailiest.  If you're working on Mono-U, I'd start with Ben Kowal's last list from the dailiest.  http://www.starcitygames.com/php/news/article/10435.html.

Well as I mentioned before, my meta is mostly some random rogue aggro decks, some artifact based decks and almost no Oath/Stax/Combo.
Mostly kinda casual towards competative wanna be stuff, no power of course. And that's good for me since I'm the one that runs stuff like FoW, Library and Morphlings.

Regarding the Disrupt/Stiflel debate: I know that vs certain decks and strategies Stifle or Disrupt could be really really good, but since my metagame is totally random but mostly aggro, that means that Stifle & Disrupts aren't that effective, perhaps even useless vs some decks, so I rather run 4 Force Spikes(Legend ones of course  Wink) and deal with every kind of 1st turn Spell.

Now regarding Daze: I'm not really that sure why people prefer Daze than Force Spike, because during the first turns returning an Island to your hand is not the best thing to do. Perhaps later that's not an issue, but I don't understand why Force Spike is underplayed.
16  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 10, 2005, 05:43:51 am
I mean if you are not running Mana Drains I would definately cut atleast 1 morphling, run something like Masticore instead =).  Personally, I prefer Daze over Force Spike for later counterbattles, where they are going to tap out trying to counter your counters, or maybe even try to go broken and combo out on you. It definately comes in handy when all you gotta do is return a tapped Island to your hand Wink. I definately think Impulses too should be added, nothing like digging through your deck at an extremely cheap cc.  I mean if you are playing maindeck B2B...maybe Null Rod would compliment it? Ofcourse the Kegs would get dropped maybe for Control Magic or even Echoing Truths or 2 truths + 1 capsize?

Masticore kinda sucks in this deck, the last thing you need is an enormous card disadvantage.

I'm not sure whether Daze > Force Spike, but I want to have decent 1st turn counters and Daze ruins my tempo by forcing me to return an Island to my hand and I dont like that. Perhaps later on it's better than Spike, but I'm mostly worried of the first turns.

Capsize? I thought that no one ever played this card? Isn't Echoing Truth better?
17  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 09, 2005, 12:41:38 pm
DeMarki: even though you run Back to Basics, I would still try to splash a color. White gives you a great kill in Decree of Justice and you can use Flooded Strand to get a basic Plains if necessary. White also gives you Balance, a card that can still randomly win you the game.
Also, you should definitely try and play Control Magic maindeck. Oath is a terrible matchup, but with Control Magic you at least get a 50/50 chance of still winning the game (depending if Akroma shows up first or not). It's not a great answer, but I can't think of anything else that would be good maindeck.

In my metagame I have never seen Oath, mostly rogue Aggro and some fast artifact based decks so perhaps Old Man would be a better idea for 1-2 main slots rather than Control Magic. At least he can swing his wooden stick for 2, not bad for an old man like him, huh?  Razz
18  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 09, 2005, 12:03:14 pm
And while Force Spike may be a good first-turn counter, it's typically a bad counter on just about every other turn in the game. I have historically had enough problems getting Mana Leak to work after about turn 3, let alone Force Spike. (This is especially true when your opponent is tapping lands like Mishra's Workshop or Tolarian Academy to play spells.) Every time your opponent resolves a threat they didn't have to tap out for, you're going to wish that Force Spike was something else.

Later on Force Spike can be pitched to either FoW or Misdirection, so I don't see where the problem might be.


Because there are any of a number of other spells that can also be pitched to FoW and Misdirection which don't become lame after Turn 2 in today's environment.

Heck, in today's Gifts-happy environment I'd play Dissipate before I played Force Spike.

Listen, this kind of control deck is relativelly slow in comparison to many aggro/combo decks that are willing to tear it apart. That means that a 1st turn counter, aside of FoW/Misdirection, would be a very helpfull addition. The thing is that Force Spike is not only a good 1st turn counter, but a decent counter even in midgame, considering that Vintage is so fast and players usually drain their mana pool in order to finish the game as quick as possible.
Don't forget that if your opponent sees that you're running Spikes, even if you haven't any in hand, he will definitelly consider not tapping out, meaning that he will slow down his play in order to avoid the Spikes and thats good for you. 6 Pitchspells(FoW/Misdirection) mean that in mid-lategame those pesky Spikes can be easily pitched without regret.
I like to be able to cast 2 counterspells on turn 1. Don't you?
19  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 09, 2005, 10:15:58 am
And while Force Spike may be a good first-turn counter, it's typically a bad counter on just about every other turn in the game. I have historically had enough problems getting Mana Leak to work after about turn 3, let alone Force Spike. (This is especially true when your opponent is tapping lands like Mishra's Workshop or Tolarian Academy to play spells.) Every time your opponent resolves a threat they didn't have to tap out for, you're going to wish that Force Spike was something else.

Later on Force Spike can be pitched to either FoW or Misdirection, so I don't see where the problem might be.
20  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 09, 2005, 07:44:46 am
If you're unpowered and have to stay mono-U...

-4 Force Spike
-4 Brainstorm
+4 Chalice of the Void
+4 Impulse
+2 Some bounce spell (I'm thinking Echoing Truth)

Force Spike is lame if your mana denial strategy isn't working perfectly, and Impulse is better than Brainstorm in this deck because you have so many functionally redundant cards, and therefore can afford to see three of them go to the bottom of your deck.

Chalice is awesome for sure.

And you really want some way to deal with a problem permanent once it's actually in play, that doesn't require you to wait forever for Powder Keg.

I don't run Chalices cause my meta is unpowered and there are no 0-1cc threats to be afraid of, like Welders and stuff.

Brainstorm is >>>>> Impulse and it requires half thaty mana, it can be played 1st turn to fix your draw and it's 100% Broken if combined with a Fetchland. God why I'm a telling you those I thought you knew better than me. Impuse is only used if you run Chalices for 1, and that's the ONLY reason someone would run those over Brainstorm.

Force Spike is a great 1st turn counterspell, especially if you don't run any Moxen in order to play Mox-Mana Leak= 1st turn counter. And it's not only usable on 1st turn, many Vintage players play fast spell which force them to tap out almost in every turn of the game, especially the first 1-4 turns, so Force Spike is a great answer to all those fast aggresive players around.

How about the Old Man - Control Magic debate, which one would be more suitable in this deck?
21  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Mono R Sligh: Dead in the water? on: December 09, 2005, 07:33:28 am
Hammer is definitely bad. My original list was all about speed, and Hammer neither improves on that play style nor makes the newer control aspects of the deck better. Scroll as well is usually much, much worse than Lavamancer, despite the fact that it was always run in red Sligh from like, the beginning of time or something. The first decklist's whole MO was outrunning CoP:Red. The new deck just Needles it.

Ball lightning was great and all, as a six-damage one-card spell. I used to run it, too. I also used to run Fling. The bad thing about Lightning, though, is that Black Lotus is restricted.

Hammer of Bogardan is one Old School Sligh powerhouse because it deals with the fact that if Sligh fails to quickly finish the opponent and has no cards in hand or the Scrolls were somehow destroyed you have the chance to slowly finish your opponent rather than sitting and topdecking lands.
It used to be a solution and a winning condition vs control decks who used to counter every spell. Hammer kicks bluemages asses cause you can use it every single turn in the mid-lategame, without problem.
Anyway 1 Hammer won't mess up your deck, it's just one slot for god's sake and it still does 3 damage for 3 if not reccured, so think about it. Old School BABY!

Regarding Ball Lightning, it's still the fastest damage available. 6 damage for 3 mana is a bargain so what's your problem? You want to play Sligh but you're just so afraid of the so-called metagame that you prefer not to use the greatest cards ever created for this type of deck.

Oh, and I forgot the major finisher of this deck: FIREBLAST. Yes sir, 2 out of 3 games I used this babe as a finisher. Play 2 Fireblasts for free after after you're tapped out on turn 3 to finish your opponent unless he runs Misdirections. GG
22  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Yawgmoth's Will in MBC on: December 09, 2005, 07:19:16 am
Is B 2life card disadvantage better than 1BB 1 life card advantage? you BET.  Plus if it gets scary, you can kill it w/ keg.

Keg doesn't kill Enchantments actually.

But it does kill creatures+artifacts, which other cards like Edict, Contagion or Darkblast don't. So it's probably better than those.
23  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 08, 2005, 09:24:47 am
Why you don't splash white is beyond me, with a few changes you could be running 4 STP and 2-4 Exalted Angel which improves just about every issue you are going to face up until a powered deck comes along and plays with you like your nothing.

Well Mono Blue fits better with B2B and that's the reason I kept it that way.
24  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Yawgmoth's Will in MBC on: December 08, 2005, 09:20:53 am
Why don't people play Vampiric Tutor in these kind of decks? It has too many drawbacks for a MBC deck?
2. MBC is a really consistant deck, meaning there are alot of 3 and 4 of's and not alot of bombs. Even Yawgs Will isn't a bomb in this deck like it is in say Gifts or Long. So instead of wasting a turn in this slot, people tend to just put more business in this slot.

Do you think that in this kind of deck Yawgmoth's Will would be a better replacement that Vampiric?
25  Eternal Formats / Creative / Building a MUC from scratch. Suggestions needed. on: December 08, 2005, 09:05:53 am
This is my MUC deck, which I'm trying to improve for the last 8 months. I have decided to run the version below, but unfortunatelly 2 slots are still open and I'm not sure what cards to use. The deck is unpowered, so is my metagame and there is no money to buy Drains/P9 for now.

Countermagic
4 Force of Will
4 Force Spike
4 Counterspell
4 Mana Leak
2 Misdirection

Card Draw/Utilities
4 Brainstorm
4 Ophidian
1 Fact or Fiction

Control/Creatures
3 Back to Basics
3 Powder Keg
2 Morphling
2 ???

Mana Base
1 Sol Ring
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Strip Mine
4 Wasteland
4 Flooded Strand
12 Island

I'm thinking that perhaps I should run either some bounce spell, or some creature stealing spell.
I would rather use 2 Control Magic or 2 Old Man of the Sea, bouncing doesn't seem necessary to me.
Which one of those 2 cards looks more suitable to this deck? ...or What else could have a place in this deck?
Suggestions needed. Thank you!
26  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Mono R Sligh: Dead in the water? on: December 08, 2005, 08:48:06 am
I was using the following decklist for quite a while, even winning 1st at my local tournament scene. However, after a certain point, the pile started doing terribly, especially when Oath decks starting showing up. The metagame around here is different each week, depending on who shows up, but I am wondering what I can do in order to stay competitive with my version of Sleigh.

It's a bit more explosive and risky than traditional Sleigh, but I've found that it wrecks the mirror match because of that on almost every occasion. However, goblins can be a problem sometimes, especially goon.

4 Pyrostatic Pilliar
3 Price of Progress
4 Ankh of Mishra
4 Fireblast
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Grim Lavamancer
4 Mogg Fanatic
1 Wheel of Fortune
2 Fork
1 Black Vise
3 Incinerate
2 Gorilla Shaman
4 Seal of Fire

3 Wooded Foothills
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
1 Mox Ruby
1 Black Lotus
6 Mountain

Side:
4 Ensnaring Bridge
4 REB
1 Price of Progress
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Null Rod

I know that fetches are very damaging to me when I have ankh in play, but it's more of a compromise. I need deck-thinning in here in order to top-deck kill spells, and I usually must count on the fact that my opponent is nowhere near as aggro as I usually am. That's one reason why I drop Pilliar before Ankh, against just about every opponent.

As far as why I have so many burn spells: Well, I often find that I can race almost any deck as long as I aim straight for the dome, rather than killing weenies with my spells. The exceptions are decks that use Goblin Lackey, which needs to die immediately if I have no blocker, and otherwise only cards like an early Exalted Angel or CoP: Red have ruined this strategy.

Yes, I do realize that my matchup is pretty hopeless against Stax, but there are plenty of nights when Stax is absent from my metagame. It only started showing up when the proxy limit was set to 10, rather than 5, anyhow.

My explanation of cards:
Fireblast! Yes, it rocks the mirror match and any other aggro, and is awesome forked. It must get saved for last, though, because of the risk inherent in losing all of one's mountains. This deck rarely gets three mana, but can often get two mountains in play, so Fireblast often works quite well. On the other hand, what mirror match? I haven't faced Sleigh at the local tourney in almost a year.

Grim Lavamancer: I detest this card when I'm playing against a player who resolves it. It's great against opposing weenies, and has lots of fuel due to fetches, fanatic, and fireblasts, and even opposing removal. Basically a tad slow, but cheap and can beat if I'm still casting bolts etc.

Mogg Fanatic: It trades with weenies in combat and gets thrown directly at my opponent's dome in response. At best, its effect can deal the final point of damage. At worst, it becomes a one damage spell for R. Still, it's always been a good addition for me.

Seal of Fire: Mostly an anti-aggro card, meant to kill opposing creatures like Goblin Piledriver and Warchief, as well as Lackey. I have also used it to kill my own spirit tokens when facing Oath, and it always comes down all surrepticiously, innocent as an enchantment that only does two damage, but deadly as a finisher.

Fork: Great with Fireblast, and sometimes can do cool things like copy Demonic Tutor and Ancestral Recall. It's mostly good late-game to copy a PoP for the win, if my opponent tries to counter it.

WoF: Well, this is often a finisher when it resolves, especially with Fireblast and Mox/Lotus. Sure, my opponent will have a full hand after my turn, but late-game, most decks begin to run out of FoW, and aren't as likely to draw into them. Against other aggro decks, I will wait till my hand is gone before casting it, unless I only need a little bit of damage to win.

Ensnaring Bridge: Well, its mostly for boarding against Oath and Colossus, but it hasn't worked out that well. One shining moment saw me facing Oath, with no removal in sight for several turns, though, so it's always a consideration.

I have since altered the deck as follows:

-3 Incinerate
-1 Fork
-1 PoP
+2 Shrapnel Blast
+3 Pithing Needle

SB:
-4 E. Bridge
-3 Null Rod
+2 Rack and Ruin
+1 Pithing Needle
+1 Tormod's Crypt
+1 PoP

I decided that I needed some tech against Welder and even CoP, and I hope that Pithing Needle will help out, it being the cheapest method to nuke abilites, if a bit reactive. I added the Shraps because of the added artifact volume, and to replace Incinerate, which just didn't seem economic enough to me.

Also, I finally found R+R, which I am considering adding more of. 3CC is a bit high, but it's still useful.

Ensnaring Bridge never resolved after the last time It became useful, and it was too high CC anyhow.


This makes my games against Oath harder, but I am hoping to race it the same way I race Colossus, with lots and lots of burn.

Anyway, the point of this post is to ask the question: Is Sligh dead? Are there cards that would help it out against the changing metagame? I heard somewhere that Sleigh decks are  using more utility than before, and don't necessarily want to drop their hands either.

I've found no new lists so far ol, so I'm willing to accept that Sleigh is dead and go on, but the deck has been quite rewarding and fun to play in the past, and there is truth to the axiom, "Sometimes Sligh just wins."

Anyone have any suggestions or lists to post, especially with regard to how to kill Oath of Druids and other problem enchantments? Is pithing needle optimal, rather than Null rod?

Help would be greatly appreciated.

In my opinion a competative MonoRed Sligh should definitelly run:

4 Gorilla Shamans/Goblin Vandals
4 Ball Lightning
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
3 Price of Progress
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Hammer of Bogardan
4 Cursed Scroll
4 Barbarian Rings
1 Strip Mine
4 Wasteland
4 Fetchlands

These are stamples, if you prefer not to use them in Sligh, then I feel sorry for you.
27  Vintage Community Discussion / Rules Q&A / Question about Phyrexian Negator on: December 07, 2005, 07:43:33 am
If I have a Negator in play which is dealt 3 damage, can I:

Sacrifice the Negator as the first permanent that has to be sacrificed and spare the other 2 sacrifices this way? or should I sacrifice 3 permanents regardless if I sacrifice the Negator or not?
28  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Yawgmoth's Will in MBC on: December 07, 2005, 07:06:10 am
DeMarki:

Yawgs Will is good. I would run it over the vamp. On a side note though, you are correct about the Void/Will interaction. Could you consider replacing the Voids with Withered Wretch? They will basically do the same thing, but it comes with a 2/2 body and it doesn't screw your Will. Otherwise good deck.

Oh, and on the edicts, I would run a couple. DSC and Oath'd creatures run rampant (at least in my meta). Good Luck.

In my meta people don't run many Colossus/Morphlings but many stupid weenies and artifacts, so keg takes good care of them.

Why don't people play Vampiric Tutor in these kind of decks? It has too many drawbacks for a MBC deck?
29  Eternal Formats / Creative / Re: Yawgmoth's Will in MBC on: December 06, 2005, 10:39:50 am
I politely suggest that you do some online research in the field of black based Vintage decks.

*Seriously, Powder Kegs? 

I did my research as well as my playtesting and I figured that this is a MBC version that I really like and suits my playstyle.
My only question that I have left is what should be more suitable in this deck, Will or Vampiric?

Powder Keg is my best removal cause it helps against almost every annoying artifact as well as 1-3cc creature. I cannot deal with Colossus nor with Akroma, but really, do you think that I should run Edicts just in case I run into these creatures? cause Keg handles almost everything else including artifacts.
30  Eternal Formats / Creative / Yawgmoth's Will in MBC on: December 05, 2005, 07:41:19 am
Do you agree that Will isn't that effective in MBC in comparison to other combo/control decks?
I really can't tell if I should include it or not, if yes then I have to replace a Vampiric Tutor.
Here's my decklist:

4 Duress
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Sinhole
4 Dark Ritual
4 Phyrexian Negator
4 Nantuko Shade

3 Nether Void
3 Powder Keg
1 Necropotence
1 Vampiric Tutor/Yawgmoth's Will
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Demonic Consultation

1 Sol Ring
1 Strip Mine
4 Wasteland
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Polluted Delta
12 Swamp

Many people say that Will should be included in every deck that runs black, but I'm not that sure about this one since after Void hits play, problably on turn 3-5, then Will is totally unplayable while Vampiric can still be played.
Will is supposed to be played usually in turns >4, in order to replay a Ritual or two/wasteland/discard/sinhole etc

Vampiric on the other side can fetch the Void on early turns if needed, but what else to fetch since you get the card on your next turn? Perhaps a Strip mine/wasteland but most spells are played 3-4 copies and they're not hard to get.
What do you you suggest me to do? After weeks of playtesting I will appreciate the advice of more experienced players. Thanx!
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