Is Stasis viable again?

[spindrift]

I know Stasis is a favorite deck of everyone on these forums! LOL! Anyway, with the unrestriction of both Gush and Black Vise, can Stasis once again be a viable deck? With mono-blue capabilities, this deck can actually be a very control-agressive deck.

Here is a rough idea of a deck that I have put together.

Creatures 
4   Chronatog   


Spells 
4   Brainstorm   
3   Chain of Vapor   
4   Daze   
4   Force of Will   
4   Gush   
2   Thwart   


Enchantments 
4   Stasis   

 
   Artifacts 
1   Black Lotus   
4   Black Vise   
3   Crucible of Worlds   
1   Mox Sapphire   
2   Null Rod   


Lands 
4   Flooded Strand   
16   Island 
 

With Gush/Thwart/daze, there are so many spells that return islands to your hand.

With Chain of Vapor, you can target your own stasis and sack a land to target another threat that your opponent may have. You can then replay your lands with Crucible. You can also use Crucible to return sack lands or discarded islands.

The black vise is just a pain to deal with in a stasis style deck and now we get to have 4!!

Chronatog is an excellent win condition, especially if you have a black vise in play.

I am open to improvments to the deck as well as thoughts on it's viability.  The only thing I ask is that we keep it Mono Blue.

Thanks

[acidfreak]

Why would you pay  for a long stasis game if you can win with flash instead?

[fallen_13]

Because sometimes its more fun to see ppl squirm in their seats being oh so helpless since they can't do anything?

Anyway, based on the list above. I'm not a fan of chronatog as most of the time, i'd rather not waste my turn away. I would suggest looking into Frozen Aether, as it helps to avoid the white splash needed back in the days when Kismet was played. And your deck should include Acall as well. Which blue deck doesn't run it, seriously? 4 black vise feels like an overkill to me cuz i feel that a more controllish lock would be better, so i would probably lessen the black vise count, 3 as a max?

The last time i played my Stasis deck, i had in place Tanglewire as an alternate "taping" source just in case my opponent stalls with a lot of untapped lands and my Kismet didn't come into play in time. Of course, i also played Ancient Tomb to power out my tanglewire slightly faster. Will try to dig out my old list, modify some and post here for some debates.

Overall, if i were to say, i would still find Stasis to be hard to play as a competitive prison deck. Workshop just seems to beat it in every way, with smokestack and tanglewires...

[spindrift]

On the same lines of thinking, why would I play flash when I can counter it and win in just a few turns with a black vise?

Oops, forgot the recall.

[rmn]

Wow, stasis is so completely useless against Ichorid.

I love the deck, but it's going to need to change quite a bit to fit with the metagame.  Figure out which decks need to untap permanents to win (maybe Flash, but not Ichorid), and then come up with a backup plan for those that don't.

[Skadrian]

it works with frozen aether, but that makes it rather slow

[Sarah Angel]

I used to play stasis (w/ kismet) a long, long, long time ago and I always thought, and still do, that you must have a kismet effect (not saying it has to be kismet, but there are a number of other options).  Tanglewire dosent do anything against stuff they might bring in from their hand on their turn.  If they bring in one untapped land, many times that's enough for them to start a chain reaction that ends up in bye bye stasis or a kill.

Not to mention the cards on their board, when you play stasis, that are untapped and can be used once.

[netherspirit]

I'm running a UW Stasis list with Mind Over Matter, Flash and Academy Rector. It sounds clunky but it works really well, especially now that Gush is available. I've been consistently locking my opponent out on about turn four or five.

[mistervader]

Isn't it possible to make it a Drain deck?

Just wondering.

I know it's a long shot at winning tournaments, but a Drain Stasis deck sounds cute.

[MagiKarp]

I have been toying with the idea of making a Workshop prison deck that uses stasis as yet another lock piece. I have a tentative list that is still undergoing major changes, but basically it looks like this:

Creatures

4 Chronotog

Lock Pieces

4 Stasis
4 Tangle wire
4 Smokestack
4 Sphere of Resistance
1 Trinisphere

Other

4 Gush
4 Black Vise
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Tinker
1 Tinker Target (Karn, Sundering Titan, etc)

Mana Sources

5 Moxen
1 Black lotus
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Sol Ring
4 Mishra's Workshop
1 Tolarian Academy
1 Strip Mine
4 Wasteland
9 Island


Now some reasons behind these choices so far.

First, I went mono-blue for a few reasons. Since just about everyone has 7+ graveyard hate sideboard slots, I figured that running a Welderless list makes sense. This cuts down my dependence on a frail guy that needs to survive a turn to be useful, and at the same time, probably makes my opponent board completely incorrectly for game 2.Running only one color also lets me bulk up on the amount of islands I can run to support Gush.

Normally, dropping a Chalice for 2 is one of my favorite things to do with a workshop deck. Unfortunately, considering that Stasis, Chronatog, and Sphere are all 2 drops, this did not really seem like a viable option for the deck. I could still see running them to drop at 0 and 1, but right now, I don't have them in the list.

Crucible did not make this initial list for the same reason as Welder, in an effort to make the deck as graveyard independent as possible. I could see running this though, since I have the 5 strip effects in the deck.

I have not done any testing with this list yet, so I'm not sure how well Gush will play in it. Anytime I get a chance to draw a few extra cards in a workshop deck, I try to take it, and since gush pairs well with stasis, I figured I would give it a try. I am considering running Meditate in place of/in addition to Gush also.

It would be nice to run some counters, particular force/misdirection since I am running a higher concentration of blue cards than I normally would in a workshop deck, but so far I have not been able to find a way to include them and all of the lock pieces I want to run.

Black Vise is probably overkill, but it works with the lock as well as with the alternate kill (getting out a tinker target, probably Karn). I also have not ruled out boarding into Workshop aggro, in which case dropping a first turn black vise or two would help the damage add up that much faster.

The deck might be a bit too mana heavy as I am not running as many high casting cost artifacts as most Workshop decks do, so I am considering cutting back in that area to possible add a few counters/crucibles.

[Methuselahn]

If Goblins were the top deck in Vintage, I would be having myself huge bonars over Stasis.  But Goblins kinda suck right now, as does the untap step.  Sadly, I don't think Stasis is viable.

[Nevermore]

I think in order for stasis to be viable it needs to have frozen aether or propaganda to be competitive with ichorid or flash.  Until it can get stasis out, it needs to play like a control deck.  A skeleton for the deck I was considering:

Win:
3x Black vice or chronatog

Core
4x Stasis
4x Frozen Aether
 (Propaganda?)

Draw
1x Ancestral recall
4x Gush
4x Brainstorm
1x Time walk

Protection
4x Force of will
4x Mana drain
4x Daze
2x Misdirection
3x Chain of Vapor
(good for protection and bouncing back stasis)
4x Tormods Crypt

Land
1x mox sapphire
1x black lotus
16x Island
(probably need better land base, too many cards maindecked for more)

SB
4X energy flux
4x arcane lab
2x propaganda
1x feldons kane
4x stifle

The deck can protect itself pretty well and mana drains help accelerate the lock components.

[dawgie]

Isn't it possible to make it a Drain deck?

Just wondering.

I know it's a long shot at winning tournaments, but a Drain Stasis deck sounds cute.

Don't you even dare about it and play it in our local tournies. You know how and another teammate (well maybe the local meta) feel about the concept. lol

The deck is too slow and other control decks are better.
Its really a fun deck though where you just irritate the other player.

[TopSecret]

How about making a UG Aggro/Stasis deck?

This would allow for:

Root Maze: Basically a one mana Kismet, although it does effect both players

Quirion Ranger and/or Scryb Ranger + Tropical Island and/or Breeding Pool:
This would combo with an in play Stasis to keep it out indefinitely, and supply beaters.
Note: The above cards have anti-synergy with Rootmaze.

Quirion Dryad: An awsome beater that is good with free spells like Force of Will, Gush, and Daze.

Fastbond (and/or Exploration, but not so much): Randomly sacking into Fastbond would allow you to combo out with Gushes..etc.

Elvish Spirit Guide: Probably not maindeck worthy, but a free mana source option none-the-less

By adding green for some synergistic creatures and Rootmaze,
you'd also be making Black Vise better as well, because the damage'd stack up faster.
It would also give you a backup plan, and the ability to use Stasis and Root Maze as tempo plays.

Just throwing it out there!

PS: I know it doesn't combo with Gush, and is not great on it's own, but would it be worth using a Forsaken City or two?
I didn't see it in the above lists, so I wasn't sure if people remembered that it keeps Stasis alive.

[wethepeople]

I fail to understand your timing with the decks "return" entirely. Gush is unrestricted, causing countless decks to run it as a 4'of. Gush alone allows your opponent to return tapped Islands, draw, and set up a win while you do absolutely nothing for fifty-three turns. All they need to do nowadays is either Gush a few times, and set up a kill to win in the period of one turn (using Storm), or get just two untapped Islands on the board, so they can cast Flash and win right there.

[spindrift]

while you do absolutely nothing for fifty-three turns

If you have a Black vise or two in play, you win in just a few turns. It is much more agressive than the old stasis deck.

[Skadrian]

and gush is very, very good in stasis

[wethepeople]

while you do absolutely nothing for fifty-three turns

If you have a Black vise or two in play, you win in just a few turns. It is much more agressive than the old stasis deck.

Having a Black Vise in play will deal 3 damage each turn, going from there, it will take atleast seven turns to win. This isn't my exagerrated "fifty-three" turns, but, it is quite slow. Current Vintage decks only really need to tap their lands once a game to win. You may be able to get lucky, and drop Stasis before they go off, and when they are tapped out. However, it only takes 2-3 mana for Combo decks to win, so breaking out of the Stasis-lock really isn't as difficult as it used to be. So while you Bolt your opponent over the course of seven turns, they will be laying lands, preparing to cast a lethal Tendrils.

[mistervader]

Isn't it possible to make it a Drain deck?

Just wondering.

I know it's a long shot at winning tournaments, but a Drain Stasis deck sounds cute.

Don't you even dare about it and play it in our local tournies. You know how and another teammate (well maybe the local meta) feel about the concept. lol

The deck is too slow and other control decks are better.
Its really a fun deck though where you just irritate the other player.

B-but... think of the possibilities!

I open with land, Mox Sapphire, and then you cast a spell that I don't need to counter, but I FOW it.

Then, I drain my FOW!

Then, on my turn, I use 3 colorless mana for Frozen Aether, and then 1 colorless mana for Stasis. EOT, I chain of Vapor Stasis.

I untap, replay Stasis, then sit still, since I had no Black Vise in my hand as a kill condition.

Exciting, huh? :p

Seriously, can anyone at least tell me what is wrong with turning Stasis into a Drain deck? I think Draining into your lock would be the most efficient way to establish a lock ASAP.

[Sarah Angel]

It's a very good point about vintage decks not having too hard a time breaking a stasis lock.

Against combo, they just have too much artifact mana.

I will agree that frozen aether is (probably) too slow to be truly viable in vintage.  You'd have to run 4 and you'd have to run 4 stasis.

Even with a draw that included stasis and frozen, you'd have to hope for a gush to really seal the deal, and even then, you'd need some extra artifact help.  Let's say that you are going to get a turn 2 and play first.  Let's even assume you brainstorm in to a lotus:

Opening hand:  Frozen, stasis, gush, island/pain land (or dual land island), mox (something like that), FOW/Misdirection/daze, brainstorm.

Lay island, brainstorm.  Take lotus, put back island/dual/painland and another island)

Lay lotus, lay mox.  Sac lotus, play frozen aether.

Opponent is now facing Frozen aether.  Assume they cant do anything (lay a tapped land and a tapped mox).

Turn 2.  Draw island (or dual/pain). Lay island.  Play stasis.  Gush.  Draw another island and something else, hopefully a blue card to pitch to FoW/misdirect.

So at end of turn 2 you have:

FoW/misdirect and a pitch, two lands in hand, stasis aether on table.

Not bad, and now you can hope for chronatog.  But that's a pretty "Best case scenario".

What are the chances of putting a frozen aether in to play first turn??  Not high at all.  In fact, most deck lists I've seen only include a lotus and a few moxes and maybe crypt.

And if you don't put frozen aether in to play very quickly (or something like it), I don't see how this deck really makes much an impact in vintage.

I would think Chalice for zero would help you a lot and in my mind, if not going to go the frozen aether route, you have to play a chalice or a null rod.

Put me in the camp that dosent think this is viable yet.

[UrDraco]

I have been thinking a lot about Stasis and I think that the Black vise kill would be amazing. A great addition to the deck would have to be Tolaria West, yes it seems slow but it is on color, uncounterable, and can get:

Tolarian Academy
Strip Mine
The Tabernacle at Pendrel Vale
Forsaken City
Tormods Crypt
Moxen/Lotus
Wasteland

The thing I am wondering is if the deck should stay Mono-U or splash black for things like Demonic tutor/Vampiric Tutor/Yawgs Will? With a black splash sideboard options like Extirpate and Leyline of the Void open up.

[Sarah Angel]

Drain stasis is interesting, but EVEN WITH pulling a sapphire/petal, you're still giving opponent one turn (not that big a deal I guess, since you have drain).  Let's assume that you dont pull a drain, stasis, island, sapphire, FoW, aether, pitch.....What is realistic?

Opener:  Stasis, drain, island, aether, sapphire, island , bounce

Lay island, sapphire.  Pass.

Drain opp's spell.  This assumes that they even play something first turn.  And, even with a sapphire, it would have to be for 4 or more mana.   Ok, so you drain a 4 spell:

draw a land.  Lay second island.  Tap 2 blue, 4 colorless from drain.  Lay aether, stasis.

Opponent still has at least one mana if not a mox/petal/crypt/lotus as well to break out on his turn.

End of their turn, bounce stasis.

If we agree that the sapphire, drain, FoW, stasis, aether, land draw is extremely far-fetched (inconsistent), and the hand above is not exactly consistent, nor is it that fast (still gives opp a few turns).  Plus, the opponent must play spells early.  They must play big spells (not likely).

If those conditions arent met (likely), we're talking about waiting til turn 3 or 4, at best, to lock and that just isnt viable.  Though gush would help with drain...But that's yet another card you'd have to draw.

[Bill Copes]

Wouldn't orb of dreams work well in this list?

[Skadrian]

It would make it hard to keep stasis in play, I think it is only viable when you have chronatog or maybe Forsaken City in play with stasis, making it a 3 card lock

[MagiKarp]

Breaking a stasis lock becomes much, much more unlikely if there is a Sphere of Resistance/Trinisphere in play. For that reason more than any other, I think stasis could see play in some sort of stax deck that could easilly power out one of those artifacts turn 1. The normal lock pieces slow the opponent down in exactly the same way in a traditional workshop deck, adding in stasis just gives you another spell to cast that your opponent scoops to.

[Bill Copes]

It would make it hard to keep stasis in play, I think it is only viable when you have chronatog or maybe Forsaken City in play with stasis, making it a 3 card lock

I don't think a permanent lock (keeping stasis in play) is absolutely necessary -- just something to buy you enough time to set up your other components to win.  Stasis itself could be a nice stall tactic for a couple turns just to let a smokestack do it's job.

I think orb of dreams is going to be a necessary component in any shop deck for the next few months, if anything just to remove the advantage of fastbond + gush.

[MagiKarp]

I think orb of dreams is going to be a necessary component in any shop deck for the next few months, if anything just to remove the advantage of fastbond + gush.

I could see it as being a potentially useful tool in a workshop deck, but certainly not necessary to counteract Fastbond + Gush brokenness. The earliest forms of Stax were made primarilly to beat GAT back before Gush was restricted in the first place, so saying that a card that was not even around then is now going to be necessary in the deck probably is not true.

[Bill Copes]

I could see it as being a potentially useful tool in a workshop deck, but certainly not necessary to counteract Fastbond + Gush brokenness. The earliest forms of Stax were made primarilly to beat GAT back before Gush was restricted in the first place, so saying that a card that was not even around then is now going to be necessary in the deck probably is not true.

What was better back then?

[MagiKarp]

I'm not saying that anything was necessarily better, just that the deck was already more than able to handle Gush + Fastbond without it. I feel like the effect of orb would probably be more trouble than it was worth with stasis in the picture; dropping it before or after playing a stasis will slow you down much more than dropping a sphere of resistance, and sphere is going to hurt the opponent more because thats one more tapped permenant for every spell they want to cast, not just for every permenant they play.

[Nevermore]

I dont think green splash for rootmaze or a stax deck for stasis would be good.  It doesnt stop ichorid or flash creatures.  Orb of dreams is a possibility as mentioned but I think it hurts you too much to play, it would be too difficult to keep stasis going.
I think the mana drain option that was suggested with frozen aether is the key play.  Tormods crypt is a good idea for main decking I think, as I put in my build mentioned before.  Im still not sure about what a good land base is.