Surgical Extraction

[Womba]

http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/arcana/686

It looks like things are going to be a littler harder for dredge considering any deck can run this thanks to the Phyrexian Mana Symbols. It seems like a very nice inclusion into other decks that would not be running Jailer and/or Leyline. At worse it seems like a free spell for storm decks that can potential remove their opponents FoWs if they already countered something....

[bun]

Wow.  I love hyperbole, so that looks like an auto-include as a four-of in every sideboard.  Yikes.  I love it.  Leyline didn't kill ichorid at all, but this has the nasty advantage of being castable, not needing to be in your opening hand, and upping your storm count.  I can think of plenty of decks this won't hurt very much, but I can't think of any deck that would be at a disadvantage running this, unless you simply don't expect to need it and don't want to waste the slots.

Neato.

[serracollector]

I love this card for the fact you can go first turn Duress/Thoughtseize, and cast this right after for 2 life.  Going first against MUD this "could" be way potentially better than Having Force + Another blue card.
I am sure it has other applications for this line of play in other "non restricted list" decks.  Grab a first turn oath off duress, then remove them all?  Against Big blue I guess you could grab a lucky FoW or drain, my 2 cents.

Pretty much I just think this card could be really good and cheap in a 4x Duress/4 x Thoughtsieze deck, maybe along side that new Preators Grip.

[bun]

I love this card for the fact you can go first turn Duress/Thoughtseize, and cast this right after for 2 life.  Going first against MUD this "could" be way potentially better than Having Force + Another blue card.
I am sure it has other applications for this line of play in other "non restricted list" decks.  Grab a first turn oath off duress, then remove them all?  Against Big blue I guess you could grab a lucky FoW or drain, my 2 cents.

Pretty much I just think this card could be really good and cheap in a 4x Duress/4 x Thoughtsieze deck, maybe along side that new Preators Grip.

I didn't even think of that, that's brilliant.  And if they Force your Duress, that's still nasty.  Even as a purely reactive card, this is great though.

[serracollector]

Yes, in a sense it turns a first turn Duress into a FoW effect, and free effects are always nice. And if not its on color.
This card can also be used in MUD, Fish, and Dredge, its just, well sick IMO.  MUD has Jar, and new sword that m

I know this is a vintage forum, and this card IMO is going to be an obvious card used in t1, just for the reason stated above, but I love how well it gonna work in a t2 Mill deck  lol It can be mono blue! and run 4!

[Troy_Costisick]

Another great Dredge hoser!  In Vintage, we like free spells.  Check out the art too, it's a beautiful card:

[MaximumCDawg]

Beautiful?  It looks like a metal band cover from the 1980s.

That said, the fact that this card is free is enormous.  The aforementioned t1 seize/duress + extract is so potent that I wonder if mono black actually has a chance of being a contender now.  Perhaps the second birth of Dark Times? 

I guess the trouble is that Duress+Extract will have a problem dealing with blue decks that are just piles of broken singletons.

[Bill Copes]

Extirpate doesn't see much play.  I'm not so sure this will, either.

[Troy_Costisick]

Extirpate doesn't see much play.  I'm not so sure this will, either.

Extirpate saw a lot of play during the Second Gush era.  Conditions aren't right for that card at the moment (no Flash, too much MUD, Ritual decks are dead), but that could change.  The fact that this card is free, playable by any color, is really big IMO.

[Shax]

Simple sideboard option. Definatley has some uses for topdeck material mid-range latgame against obviously anything graveyard based. I would definatly include it as a 4-of in the sideboard for MUD Combo over Leyline of the Void, or Bridge since it fights Blue decks better than both of those cards. If you notice a trend. Whenever you get things for 'Free' in Vintage, it turns out it will most likely be played. (IE* Ancestral Recalls card advantage. Jace, TMS drawing loads of cards every turn past the first. Moxen/Lotus/Crypt/Petal/Mox Opal. Leylines. Force of Will. Gush. Yawgmoth's Will mid/late game.) This card costing just -2 is some tech I would strongly consider for Vintage. Since it is 'Free'. As a note most of the cards I listed are not free at all. Especiall Y.Win. Thats win more on my part of typing. You could include bomb' spells in that category, Desire, Necro, Bargain etc. So I retract on Y.Win. Force is card disatvantage.. but it has no other cost besides -1 life if played like that and removing a card. Gush, yeah its free for two island drops. Recall is about as free as it gets, but cost  . Jace has the cost of 2 , but the cards it provides become free in short time after activation. Cards that actually cost 0 are free, so I would have to think that Black is going to be a little bit more legit with some of the new guys added. Hexmage is it's MVP still, unless you want to go super rogue with Hex Parasite and Dark Depths combo in.. MUD or some other colors to splash like Blue? lol. Would be pretty sick using Metalworker and Parasite turn two for Depths counters to be removed and a buff Parasite. Sounds like Greater Gargadon. That has playability, even.

[Meddling Mike]

I'm not really sure what to think about this card. The obvious comparison is to Extirpate as it has an identical effect once resolved and the fact that both can be cast for one black mana. Is trading in Split-Second for the ability to cast it for 2 life points a good trade? It's hard to say. Although some folks were talking about potentially using this as a means of hating out Dredge, I was considering it more as a weapon for Dredge. The reduction in casting cost is a really big plus for the Dredge deck which is often strapped for mana AND it has great synergy with Cabal Therapy. Even casting it on something meh in the graveyard so you don't have to go blind on your first Cabal Therapy would be a nice little bonus. Basically running it in place of something like Unmask. The ability to mess up a topdeck tutor is also adorable.

In terms of hating out dredge it just seems to me like there are so many better options. Ravenous Trap immediately comes to mind as being a superior option to this card. I guess it doesn't exile them out of library or hand, but I still think removing the whole graveyard is preferential to removing 1-4 cards.

[Shax]

I wont be playing this card unless I get to hit 3-4 cards and it is used in a way that yeah, I get to Cabal Therapy their hand. Unmask is really good at what it does. Since it is 'Free'

[Stormanimagus]

I'm not really sure what to think about this card. The obvious comparison is to Extirpate as it has an identical effect once resolved and the fact that both can be cast for one black mana. Is trading in Split-Second for the ability to cast it for 2 life points a good trade? It's hard to say. Although some folks were talking about potentially using this as a means of hating out Dredge, I was considering it more as a weapon for Dredge. The reduction in casting cost is a really big plus for the Dredge deck which is often strapped for mana AND it has great synergy with Cabal Therapy. Even casting it on something meh in the graveyard so you don't have to go blind on your first Cabal Therapy would be a nice little bonus. Basically running it in place of something like Unmask. The ability to mess up a topdeck tutor is also adorable.

In terms of hating out dredge it just seems to me like there are so many better options. Ravenous Trap immediately comes to mind as being a superior option to this card. I guess it doesn't exile them out of library or hand, but I still think removing the whole graveyard is preferential to removing 1-4 cards.

I think this is wrong. Being able to RFG ALL bridges is huge. The main reason this gets the nod over Extirpate is that it will see play in Noble Fish and GW beats. This trumps Ravenous Trap for those decks I think as it can stop them from EVER making Zombies. No longer can they slow play a bridge or two and play THROUGH Rav. Trap. This + Rav Trap gives Noble Fish many different lines of attack against the Dredge player that aren't Jank like Relic Of Progenitus. Thanks Wizards!

[ELD]

The difference between 1 and zero mana is enormous.  It's like the difference a mortal man and Bill Copes. 

[meadbert]

I am with Meddling Mage.  This is probably better in Dredge than against it.
I beat Extirpate all of the time and it was not because it did not come out fast enough or because Therapied it or because it cost too much.
Resolved Extirpate just does not do enough.  It is somewhere between Half and One Time Walk vs Dredge.

[Bill Copes]

Resolved Extirpate just does not do enough.  It is somewhere between Half and One Time Walk vs Dredge.

This is what I was thinking -- I should have specified that I meant against dredge.  Yanking one card (even 4 of them) won't be enough to get there, most of the time.  Pulling bridges for free before they can make dudes is pretty hot though.

[Darkenslight]

IS Narcomeba's ability Triggered?  IF so, then this is awesome tech against that line of play.

[TheBrassMan]

Narcomoeba is triggered, yes, so you can respond with this ... or Nihil Spellbomb or Ravenous Trap or Extirpate.  In my experience, a successful Dredge matchup has more to do with your volume of hate than the quality of it.  I don't see any reason why this wouldn't be a fine sideboard card to run against dredge - but it's not going to improve your dredge matchup near as much as freeing up another slot would.

I've always been interested in the extirpate effect in non-graveyard-based matches, but it's never really impressed me.  This is likely good enough to test in other applications, but I wouldn't be shocked if it didn't make the cut.  (If extirpate was lackluster in the Gifts metagame, where the graveyard was a more critical part of a blue deck's gameplan, this version isn't likely to be much better now).

[Troy_Costisick]

Against Gush decks it can remove all the Gushes.  Combined with Grudge it can remove Golem, Helkite, Null Rod, or whatever else.  Combined with Nature's Claim it can nail Oath.  Since you can play 8 Extirpates now, why not combine them with 8 Duresses or 8 Disenchants and totally screw your opponent's deck?

[Diakonov]

The difference between 1 and zero mana is enormous.  It's like the difference a mortal man and Bill Copes. 

I agree with this sentiment.  Being able to use all of your resources all the time and still react with this is huge.  I'd much rather have this than Extirpate most of the time, because often the effect isn't backbreaking enough to draw a counter anyway.  And if it is, then hey, you just FOW'd my free spell.  I'm OK with that.

This could be great against control decks as a one-or-two-of.  Hitting a FOW prior to a counter-war, countering topdeck tutors, killing Gush, reacting to Will, etc.  I thought the same thing about Extirpate and turned out wrong, but being a free spell might be enough to put it over the edge into playability.

Hot Cunning Wish target, too.

[Gambit]

The card is fine at what it does, but extirpate was rarely seeing play. People are talking like this a a new effect, we've essentially had this card for years. It will see some sideboard play after initial release, then it will slowly go to fewer and fewer copies.

[Zeksagmak]

Hi.  Long time lurker, first time poster. 

I figure worst case vs a non-shop/dredge, you can use it to reshuffle their lib after they mystical/vamp or just mess with their yawgwill. 

[A_Outcast]

Gambit the issue with comparing it to extirpate is that extirpate costs 1 mana, this costs 2 life.

The reason that is relevent is this can be cast on T0, which can turn the tide against what could otherwise be a devastating t0 for ichorid, or its another strong piece of hate to bring in against the t1 storm decks (which there are a few around in my meta)

[Gambit]

Gambit the issue with comparing it to extirpate is that extirpate costs 1 mana, this costs 2 life.

The reason that is relevent is this can be cast on T0, which can turn the tide against what could otherwise be a devastating t0 for ichorid, or its another strong piece of hate to bring in against the t1 storm decks (which there are a few around in my meta)

I get the difference, but I don't think this card will see heavy play, but will see some sideboard play. It is just another piece of graveyard hate. In your situation, rav. trap would likely be just as good, and that card seems to have fallen mostly out of favor. Yes, any color can play it, etc etc. It's not that the card is bad at what it does. It's that this type of effect isn't as good as people convince themselves, these effects are always looked at from the best possible situation and people seem to forget that this cost you a card, and that you may draw more of these (no it's not that good to hit multiple targets, especially in vintage with so many powerful 1 ofs)

[Sam101]

I love this card for the fact you can go first turn Duress/Thoughtseize, and cast this right after for 2 life...Grab a first turn oath off duress, then remove them all?

Is this that much better than first turn duress, second turn extirpate?

Your opponents hand would have to be nuts to search up and cast another oath before turn 2.

I am on the side that thinks it won't see play

[Wagner]

It will see play like Extirpate sees play. I sometimes use 1-2 main or SB Extirpate, now I have the option to do so in non-black decks, which is nice. It won't become a staple in sideboards, but it's a decent alternative to Extirpate, some people will prefer the Split Second, others the 2 life.

If I'm playing black, I'll usually want the Split Second as Extirpate is not an early game card.

[A_Outcast]

I agree with you gambit, but nailing their clutch 4of card is kinda the point of cards like this and extirpate.  why would you use it to nail something thats meh?  ill still pick up a set just for incase i find a use for it.  honestly i doubt ima play it, but ill probably put it in my GFs naya zoo deck board.

[Stormanimagus]

People are ignoring the simple fact that you can play this in a deck without access to black. That is its biggest strength. Noble Fish now has a SB card vs. Dredge that isn't dead vs. Gush decks (I'd even bring it in there as you have a lot of protection for it in FoW and Daze). Nabbing a wasted dual isn't bad if it cuts them off from either black or green. This card is quite good and totally different from Extirpate because non-black decks can run it as an efficient crippling tool. Extirpate sucked because black already had Leyline Of The Void to combat dredge. This gives power to decks that didn't have it til now.

4 of these +3-4 Rav Trap = much better hate vs. Dredge.

[Blue Lotus]

this card just doesn't do enough. yes its free, but the effect is not even a road bump against dredge.

Casting this on gush seems terrible. they have already drawn two cards, and you are going to give them one of yours too? 

[TheWhiteDragon]

I think the point here is that you can duress/seize turn 1 and then follow immediately with this.  It's not the greatest against dredge, but hitting bloodghasts or dread return is not at all terrible.  The real benefit is being able to thoughtseize and surgical extraction on turn 1 off 1 land...BB is not always easy on turn 1, and you don't want to burn a ritual on that play.
Also, in a blue deck, you can counter anything like an opposing fow, gush, oath, etc and immediately remove that option for the rest of the game.