Human Ingenuity

[Chubby Rain]

Congrats on your success Matt! I just miss the lands in that list :p

Could you do a raw split between your wins? (aggro, auriok+lotus, tendrils, tinker+sphinx)

I think I stormed out once or twice, beat down once against Shockwave on Dragon and twice against shops, tinkered for Sphinx against Dredge once, and the rest were won with some combination of Bomberman into tendrils. I never faced a null rod deck but the anti-creature package comes in along with the disenchants. Rebuild is the out in the maindeck and the tutors can help find it if necessary.

[xouman]

I have played dark bomberman for about half a year (about 40 matches or so, plus few hours against AI in MTGForge). My landbase is a bit different:

3 polluted delta
3 flooded strand (should be 4)
2 tundra
2 underground sea
1 island
1 plains
1 tolarian academy
1 library of alexandria
3 cavern of souls

but no mana vault. Cavern is awesome, since I play even less countermagic than you.

So you usually win thanks to auriok salvagers. I assume that you win with tendrils, but you would win also with spellbomb, right?. Is tendrils really worth it? I have used vault+key with some success, and while vault often gets decayed (never stolen by fayden up to date, I side it out) it takes lots of matches, and key has good synergy with top, trinket and auriok.

I have lost against Ur delver (against better players than me) but I have also won, a darkblast in the side helps a lot and thieves are absolute brilliant, just increase missteps to protect them from bolts (fluster also helps). Explosives also win time, but on the other side my confidants are often a trouble against Ur delver. I like to play a meekstone in the sideboard (trinket can get it) but pyromancer and its tokens bypass it so I maybe should change to another option (tinker+sphinx seems great)

Null rod has been one of the best cards against me, MUD is quite hard (I have changed from 2 katakis 2 disenchants to 4 disenchants), and overall any deck can get me into trouble. However in most of the matches I feel my deck has good options to fight for the win, simply I'm not a good player :p


PD: It's funny how null rod is the most troubling card against those decks, and we are talking about them in the "null rod" thread

[Phele]

I have used vault+key with some success, and while vault often gets decayed (never stolen by fayden up to date, I side it out) it takes lots of matches, and key has good synergy with top, trinket and auriok.

I like Tinker as an alternative combo kill so far. While Vault has synergies with Trinket, Salvagers has with Tinker. And what I especially like about Tinker instead of Vault-Key is that it leaves you much less vulernable to Null Rod. The robot, lets say Sphinx, is also immune to Decay (and Dack) and can sometimes be cast with Salvagers and Lotus.

It's funny how null rod is the most troubling card against those decks, and we are talking about them in the "null rod" thread

This thread imo belongs in the Miscellaneous category. In this thread, we discuss decks with several aggro, control and combo aspects (Bomberman for example), but very rarely real Null Rod decks.

And on topic: What do you think is the best solution in this color combination against heavy Null Rod uses? I like Devout Witness so far the most, as it is usefull against Shops as well and the body can serve as a blocker. It also can be cast with Cavern of Souls.

[Chubby Rain]

The fact that I win because of Salvagers is largely due to the field not really interacting with him well. If people run more Dismembers, Swords, etc at some point, Tendils has value in being a kill that is not dependent on Salvagers to win the game. The deck is perfectly capable of firing off a Yawgmoth's Will, Recall, and reaching a storm count of 10. Trinket Mage attacks for 2 and mini-Tendrils for 3-4 has won games for me before. These are the main reasons I like Tendrils over say Pyrite Spellbomb.

I don't like Vault+Key because many decks are prepared to deal with it with maindeck answers like Dack Fayden and Abrupt Decay. Bob has similar issues against UR delver and BUG decks as he is very vulnerable to removal while requiring a turn to make up for the card invested. Also, once you are off the Bob plan, Cavern of Souls is generally less necessary in the early game and I have found 2 to be about right (though I could easily see 3 working).

[xouman]

Now I see how deeply confidant warps this deck. Confidant is what makes canvern and library better. Confidant is what makes tinker+robot bad. Confidant is what makes second top better, and thus voltaic key. Confidant is what receives abrupt decays, clearing space for time vault. While confidant is *bad* from the top, is one of the best openers, and often gives enough resources to overwhelm opponent. But I must confess that best starts of the deck involve

1-Early trinkets for sdt/lotus into prompt auriok (that's why I play 3 aurioks)

2-Vault/demonic/vampiric and trinket/key. The ooops factor of time vault never ceases to amaze me


In fact I could say that vault wins between 30-40% of the games, something really brutal for just 2 cards (one of them not dead itself). Yes, decay kills it, but opponent has to play with GB open all the time. Yes, fayden steals it (nobody has stole mine, but I know it would happen). Yes, null rod kills it (and kills 80% of my winning chances).

Tinker+robot in the side is interesting, but then I would have to side confidants out (at least a couple)? Would you side confidants out against UR delver? they trade with pyromancers and balance the CA, but on the other hand are easy to kill and decrease my own life...

[Chubby Rain]

UR delver is one of the reasons that I don't run Dark Confidant. Though he trades with the main body, he can't effectively block Young Pyromancer's tokens and the life loss become relevant quite quickly. When playing with UR delver in testing, it's normally not difficult to kill him but I will generally save the bolts and just try to race the card advantage Dark Confidant provides by throwing those Lightning Bolts at my opponent.

[Phele]

In my opinion Tinker + robot together with Confidant is totally fine, especially in a deck that can find Divining Top so easily with Trinkets. But it also has been in other builds like Grixis control. The robot flip does happen from time to time but very rarely and doesn't always lead to direct death. You are right, that Vault and Key offer you many easy kills but so does Tinker, which is just a single card.

I totally agree  that Confidant is not so good in the Delver matchup, even though he can still block something or kill your opponent after clearing the board (the VSL matchup between Bob Maher and Rich Shay was such an example even though things went pretty ideal for Bob). But the life loss sums up probably too quickly against such an aggressive deck. But what I don't understand is, why peoply at other places say that Confidant has become worse because of the higher amount of played removal. This might be true for decks which totally rely on little beaters but not for these kind of control-combo-aggro decks. Isn't it so that decks that play more removal play less ways to interact with your also critical instants and sorcerys like Ancestral, Walk, Will and Tinker? This is one thing I always liked about decks like Esper Bomberman or Grixis Control: You can switch roles and strategies easily even during one match.

[psyburat]

I remixed Samantha Reichert's "Man Bear Fish" deck with a few upgrades and swaps, but this'll be my starting point for Human Aggro in 2015:

MD
4 Dark Confidant
3 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Mayor of Avabruck
4 Meddling Mage
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Phyrexian Revoker
3 Shardless Agent
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

3 Abrupt Decay
4 Mental Misstep
3 Path to Exile

1 Black Lotus
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Gemstone Mine
1 Karakas
4 Mana Confluence
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Strip Mine
3 Wasteland

SB
3 Aegis of the Gods
3 Grafdigger’s Cage
3 Kataki, War’s Wage
3 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence

[Samoht]

I remixed Samantha Reichert's "Man Bear Fish" deck with a few upgrades and swaps, but this'll be my starting point for Human Aggro in 2015:

MD
4 Dark Confidant
3 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Mayor of Avabruck
4 Meddling Mage
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Phyrexian Revoker
3 Shardless Agent
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

3 Abrupt Decay
4 Mental Misstep
3 Path to Exile

1 Black Lotus
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Gemstone Mine
1 Karakas
4 Mana Confluence
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Strip Mine
3 Wasteland

SB
3 Aegis of the Gods
3 Grafdigger’s Cage
3 Kataki, War’s Wage
3 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence

I don't like Misstep just for opposing Missteps, we have way better things to be doing with our spots. Otherwise, deck looks pretty interesting. I'd think you might want to look for Spirit of the Labyrinth in there but I understand it's not a Human and thus harder to cast reliably. Also, Green Suns Zenith and Dryad Arbor look like they could easily have a home.

[psyburat]

I don't like Misstep just for opposing Missteps, we have way better things to be doing with our spots. Otherwise, deck looks pretty interesting. I'd think you might want to look for Spirit of the Labyrinth in there but I understand it's not a Human and thus harder to cast reliably. Also, Green Suns Zenith and Dryad Arbor look like they could easily have a home.

I agree with both the Mental Misstep and Spirit of the Labyrinth comments.  Given that the deck contains Shardless Agent, I was already hesitant with that interaction (although it certainly didn't cause troubles when I played him alongside Daze in Me Fish), and perhaps the deck could go up to 4 Shardless Agent without any truly dead cascade triggers.  This was carried over from Man Bear Fish, but I could just as easily sideboard or omit them for a non-Human answer to the impending metagame.

MD
4 Dark Confidant
3 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Mayor of Avabruck
4 Meddling Mage
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Shardless Agent
3 Spirit of the Labyrinth
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

3 Abrupt Decay
3 Path to Exile

1 Black Lotus
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Gemstone Mine
1 Karakas
4 Mana Confluence
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Strip Mine
3 Wasteland

SB
3 Aegis of the Gods
3 Grafdigger’s Cage
3 Kataki, War’s Wage
3 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence

[Samoht]

I don't like Misstep just for opposing Missteps, we have way better things to be doing with our spots. Otherwise, deck looks pretty interesting. I'd think you might want to look for Spirit of the Labyrinth in there but I understand it's not a Human and thus harder to cast reliably. Also, Green Suns Zenith and Dryad Arbor look like they could easily have a home.

I agree with both the Mental Misstep and Spirit of the Labyrinth comments.  Given that the deck contains Shardless Agent, I was already hesitant with that interaction (although it certainly didn't cause troubles when I played him alongside Daze in Me Fish), and perhaps the deck could go up to 4 Shardless Agent without any truly dead cascade triggers.  This was carried over from Man Bear Fish, but I could just as easily sideboard or omit them for a non-Human answer to the impending metagame.

MD
4 Dark Confidant
3 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Mayor of Avabruck
4 Meddling Mage
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Shardless Agent
3 Spirit of the Labyrinth
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

3 Abrupt Decay
3 Path to Exile

1 Black Lotus
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Gemstone Mine
1 Karakas
4 Mana Confluence
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Strip Mine
3 Wasteland

SB
3 Aegis of the Gods
3 Grafdigger’s Cage
3 Kataki, War’s Wage
3 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence

I like the look of that a lot more. Have you tested this against the recent Delver monstrosity?

[xouman]

Yeah, it looks better now, it's incredible how many good creatures are available in Vintage now. I still miss stony silence in the main, but I understand that this deck has no manipulation and there are a bunch of decks unaffected by SS.

What I don't like is the apparently fragility of the manabase. Hierarch seems a must; a misstep on it, a well placed wasteland and you go into trouble. And magus of the moon probably means shuffling again (but with delver increasing, moon decks should not be played at all).

[psyburat]

I like the look of that a lot more. Have you tested this against the recent Delver monstrosity?

No testing to speak of yet, but I'm rarely one that does so.  I'll probably proxy it up for random goldfishing to make sure opening hands work, that was pretty much the extend of my testing during my Noble Fish days.

Yeah, it looks better now, it's incredible how many good creatures are available in Vintage now. I still miss stony silence in the main, but I understand that this deck has no manipulation and there are a bunch of decks unaffected by SS.

What I don't like is the apparently fragility of the manabase. Hierarch seems a must; a misstep on it, a well placed wasteland and you go into trouble. And magus of the moon probably means shuffling again (but with delver increasing, moon decks should not be played at all).

This is something I'll discover as it plays out, but I imagine most hands want to play out in a way that favors a 1C card first turn (Confidant, Thalia) and a CD card second turn (Pikula, Shardless).  With ten pieces of fast mana and ten rainbow lands, this seems very possible.  Noble Hierarch is not the primary curve plan, but plays a secondary role nicely.

Containment Priest is a must in this, but I've posted enough untested edits for now.

[fsecco]

I find it hard to follow this topic, since there are a lot of different decks posted here. I mean, it's impossible to discuss one of them since every page or so there comes a totally different list... shouldn't we divide make separate topics for each?

[ramrodjon]

Glad to see the Noble gears turning again!  I agree that Containment Priest belongs in the starting 60, perhaps even over the Meddling Mages?  Keeping the deck BWG like Dixon and Glackins most recent lists might help with any mana problems that could arise.  

[Stormanimagus]

Ok, so I think Containment Priest warrants an update to my Junk Human list. I really like how well Containment Priest replaces his less effective Banisher cousin. Yes, I was running 2-3 Banisher Priest to deal with Tinker->Bot. Well, no longer! And now that I can run Containment Priest I can cut down easily to 2 copies of Grafdigger's Cage and 0 copies of RIP, effectively removing the anti-synergy between RIP and Knight of the Reliquary even from my sideboard. I used to run RIP in my SB as a 2-of because I knew how necessary it was for the dredge matchup, but I always hated how it flew in the face of Knight of the Reliquary. Now I can run a card that is mostly as good at stopping dredge and actually harder to remove. Ok, here it is, my most recent Knight update:

Guardians of the Galaxy

Land (23):
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Windswept Heath
1 Verdant Catacombs
2 Savannah
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
1 Karakas
1 Bojuka Bog
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
1 Maze of Ith

Artifacts (7):
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Emerald
3 Chalice of the Void

Enchantments (2):
2 Stony Silence

Creatures (24):
4 Noble Hierarch
1 Deathrite Shaman
3 Spirit of the Labyrinth
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Containment Priest
4 Dark Confidant
2 Qasali Pridemage
3 Knight of the Reliquary

Instants (4):
4 Abrupt Decay


Sideboard (15):
2 Mirran Crusader
2 Deathrite Shaman
4 Mayor of Avabruck
1 Stony Silence
2 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Containment Priest
2 Orzhov Pontiff
1 Bojuka Bog



As always, feedback is welcome. Thank you!

-Storm

[xouman]

I like the list, no suggestions here. Just questions:

1. Why sapphire, if the only blue card is misstep?
2. Why 1 drs in the main and 3 in the sb?
3. Why 3 stony silence in the main?

And now that I have checked the list a couple of times more

4. Where is Gaddock Teeg?
5. Where is spirit of the labyrinth?

[Stormanimagus]

I like the list, no suggestions here. Just questions:

1. Why sapphire, if the only blue card is misstep?
2. Why 1 drs in the main and 3 in the sb?
3. Why 3 stony silence in the main?

And now that I have checked the list a couple of times more

4. Where is Gaddock Teeg?
5. Where is spirit of the labyrinth?

I don't think Gaddock Teeg is a very good hate card anymore with the options that are available to us. If UR Delver turns out to be a horrible matchup for us I may change my tune on that though. It is very nice that Teeg his Treasure Cruise.

I don't think Spirit of the Labyrinth is that exciting either, although I was saying this before Cruise was a thing and when Bob was super popular.

I have issues with running BOTH of these guys because of their creature types and because of Spirit's susceptibility to enchantment AND creature hate.

I could see running them in place of mental misstep though.

Sapphire is entirely there to help vs. shops and to be able to drop turn 1 2-drops against Storm and/or Oath more often. Often, in those match ups, the difference between winning and losing is being able to cast Stony Silence or Containment Priest on turn 1 instead of turn 2 (especially if you are on the draw)

Dr. Shaman is also mainly in the deck to wreck shops (specifically Stax). I don't really need 6 mana producers main so that's just how the numbers have worked out for now.

Stony Silence is such a house and is so hard to remove. If anyone thinks null rod's power, as an effect, is on the wane. . . well, they are taking crazy pills. Stony Silence and Null Rod have never been more powerful imo and there are a lot of decks out being insanely greedy with 4 Mox Opals. I want to punish those decks for their insatiable greed with 1. . . stupid. . . card! This is why Stony is good. In the match ups where it shines it is like a 10, 11, 12, or even 13-for-1. How is that not good?

Hope this answers your questions.

-Storm

[Coopes]

Nice list  

I was doing pretty well with a fish build featuring MD stony on MTGO a while back before KTK hit. I haven't had a chance to play much Vintage since then, so I can't comment on how it matches up in the current meta/what that meta is online anymore. Stony was my best t1 play a lot of the time vs a good chunk of decks I was facing, with counter backup ideally and a creature to follow suite ^^. Card is so hard to remove for decks that just bank on artifact removal.

[xouman]

Don't get me wrong, I know stony silence is great. I played null rod for years (more than half my vintage tournaments), and I know null rod wrecks my bomberman.. However, current Tier 1's are less affected by stony silence. Against delver, for example, this is not a 13 for 1, it is a 3-4 for 8 (opponent loses lotus and 2-3 moxen, you lose lotus, 4 moxen and 3 stony silence). Even against those greed decks it's a 13 for 8, not 13 for 1. While it could win matches by itself, in some matches the opponent would see 3-4 of those pieces and you could see same or more

Gaddock seems well positioned against delver, and spirit even more. Ethersworn canonist also seems really interesting against delver. And I expect delver to be quite popular nowadays.

Ok about the blue mox, speed is usually key, and having 2 mana online first turn means a huge difference. With just 5 1CC drops, getting 2 mana ASAP is important.

[Stormanimagus]

Don't get me wrong, I know stony silence is great. I played null rod for years (more than half my vintage tournaments), and I know null rod wrecks my bomberman.. However, current Tier 1's are less affected by stony silence. Against delver, for example, this is not a 13 for 1, it is a 3-4 for 8 (opponent loses lotus and 2-3 moxen, you lose lotus, 4 moxen and 3 stony silence). Even against those greed decks it's a 13 for 8, not 13 for 1. While it could win matches by itself, in some matches the opponent would see 3-4 of those pieces and you could see same or more

Gaddock seems well positioned against delver, and spirit even more. Ethersworn canonist also seems really interesting against delver. And I expect delver to be quite popular nowadays.

Ok about the blue mox, speed is usually key, and having 2 mana online first turn means a huge difference. With just 5 1CC drops, getting 2 mana ASAP is important.

I still think Stony is a necessary evil to stopping stupid TV/Key plays and also, more importantly, sensei's top and overwhelming fast mana. It is one of your best options against the 4 Opal decks that can just overwhelm you. Same goes for Metalworker.

The only card I'd consider cutting for either Gaddock or Spirit would be the Missteps. Do you think they will help MORE than Misstep vs. Delver and/or combo? I mainly have them in there for the Ritual match-up cause I need a way to interact on turn 0 and 1. Now I know that ritual storm isn't as common these days but D-Day sees some play. I can certainly try a config with some number of each (I'd probably go 3 Spirit and 1 Teeg) but I think Misstep is often just better. I don't see cutting anything else maindeck or sideboard to make room for them. Do you?

-Storm

P.S. - My issue with Spirit from the get-go was that it doesn't stop bob and it also doesn't stop tutors for broken cards. if they cast jace they just bounce him and then counter him. I will rarely be able to set cavern to spirit because it will already be set to Human. I dunno. Maybe I'm not giving Spirit enough of a chance, but I'd pretty much always rather see Thalia early than Spirit. He doesn't really stop your opponent from developing mana the way Thalia does. Thalia stops both mana and card development all at once. To me, this makes her infinitely better than Spirit or Teeg. Teeg is an interesting card. I used to be all about it. I suppose I'll have to reconsider it now that Cruise is really a thing. However, remember he costs GW to cast and I will not likely be setting cavern on advisor either. This means I have 9 lands that don't add the mana needed to cast this guy. Spirit is a little easier on the manabase so I'd sooner run her than Teeg. Those are my thoughts. Thanks for the input everyone!

-Storm

[xouman]

It's true than your manabase and the cavern effect are not really synergical with spririt or Gaddock. However spirit/gaddock seem even better than thalia against delver, since thalia slows them but does not stop at all. Gaddock annuls gush, TC, fow. Spirit annuls half Gush, TC, preordain. On the other side, thalia is a better blocker and that could save matches, although I'm not sure which role is correct for humans against Delver (it really depends on the build).

Thalia is better against confidant, but it seems that confidant is on the low (maybe a BW deck is the way to go?). I love "humans" because it's really really big now, there are tons of playable cards in one deck or another.

[Stormanimagus]

It's true than your manabase and the cavern effect are not really synergical with spririt or Gaddock. However spirit/gaddock seem even better than thalia against delver, since thalia slows them but does not stop at all. Gaddock annuls gush, TC, fow. Spirit annuls half Gush, TC, preordain. On the other side, thalia is a better blocker and that could save matches, although I'm not sure which role is correct for humans against Delver (it really depends on the build).

Thalia is better against confidant, but it seems that confidant is on the low (maybe a BW deck is the way to go?). I love "humans" because it's really really big now, there are tons of playable cards in one deck or another.

Changed the list to include Spirit of the Lab as a 3-of maindeck. I also switched out all mental missteps for chalice of the void. I think chalice might just be better overall right now. Let me know what you think. The list has been updated so check out my recent post.

-Storm

[xouman]

ummm, i like it more than before Playing chalices also lets switching a stony silence.

To say something, the black access to Decay is restricted to few cards, and I think they would be dead in your hand from time to time. I don't know if the best way to handle it is another fetch or another dual, but if your bayou/scrubland gets wasted it could take time to get the second black land.

But overall the list looks wonderful!

PD: remember thay you can play Cotv at 2 and still play abrupt decay, and creatures with cavern

[Guli]

Containment Priest is a big deal for Human Caverns. The ability is unique and unseen and in my opinion has the potential to push the archetype onwards in such a way that it might force people to start packing real hate towards Human decks. Being flash and being human makes the card an uncounterable counter (in other words reliable) to broken things. With priest in play the opponent is forced to play normal, cast castable creatures and try to win from there. But remember that with a Mayor in play (or in your hand), this card reads as a 3/3 with flash, which could introduce some nice tactics in combat or end of turn surprises against planeswalkers.

[xouman]

Yes, priest is really interesting with Mayor. It could even work as Exava dealing with jace, as you note!

Human decks are getting nice pieces, and they are probably better than ever. If people start playing hate to them, maybe the black oath can be a great choice to play (however since graveyards are getting hosed so easily, it's a liability...)

[serracollector]

The more i read about creature filled vintage with human and delver decks (which technically with delver and young pyromancer and snapcaster all being humans it is also a human deck) it really makes me want to just start running four abrupt decays and four pernicious deed in every deck that the mana base allows.

[Guli]

Yes, priest is really interesting with Mayor. It could even work as Exava dealing with jace, as you note!

Human decks are getting nice pieces, and they are probably better than ever. If people start playing hate to them, maybe the black oath can be a great choice to play (however since graveyards are getting hosed so easily, it's a liability...)

Humans is not about cast a hatebear and pass the turn. Though sometimes it may seem that way for those who are not very familiar with the mechanics of what I call 'Humans'. I have succesfully used the Haste and Flash abilities in what I call 'Humans' before and those were 4 casting cost threats (Exava and Notion Thief). There is a huge difference between 2 and 4 casting cost. Having access to a card like Priest does open up new lines of play in various match ups. It can change the deck at its core, meaning that there could be cards (human or otherwise) that could now make the deck that haven't been high on the list before. Turn 1 Cavern and Mox to get a Thalia in play is still my favorite opening against most decks, but other than that, anything is possible.

Just imagine you are holding a Priest in hand and you have 2 mana open. It is your opponents end turn. Normally you would like to wait and use Priest as a counter in response to someone who is dedicating his resources (mana and cards) so you can waste his turn. However if the opponent is aware and decides to slow roll his mega threat, then you have to be ready for that too. You can't just keep 2 mana open the entire game. Yea you could flash it in play if you have another one in your hand. I would still like to have additional instant speed (or flash) cards to be used when the opponent is playing a wait and see game. I always liked this kind of options in Humans, similar to those blue angel decks which is all about flashing in value dudes like Snapcaster, Resto angel, Aven, and others. So I would probably play 2 Notion Thief alongside Priest and also have something else. This can be Sensei Top to sink in mana (with vamp/worldly tutor you could get in Priest in play fast and in response) that would otherwise be unused.

There could also be other Humans with flash or other instants that could be interesting. I like the idea of having 1 Aven and 1 Hushwing Gryff as non humans, especially if there are to be tutors around and diggers like top. Eventually you would have a deck with the ability to use its mana smoothly and have a more reactive approach to the problems it might face. Obviously not every card will be like that, you will have openers like turn 1 Thalia or maybe turn 1 Mayor (which is strong against dredge and Workshop with a wasteland). But once you drop your 'non flash' guy, you want to sit back and become more reactive and controling. Mayor and Thalia are good with this kind of approach. If I find the time and motivation, I will start a new design, but for now I don't feel like doing it. Maybe coopes can come up with a list, he knows how I approach/design since we worked closely for a while (with good results online).

**Edit: Wanted to add that Priest is also strong against Tangle Wire to build up permanent count.

Cheers

[Guli]

I think Humans can be a very strong meta call right now.



Thalia and Priest are the best Humans to fend off broken plays in Vintage. Given the opponent has not found the fastbond, Thalia is very effective against Gush.



Mayor and Pontiff are both very useful in many ways. They are strong in match ups where creatures will clash and removal / attrition is relevant. They also read as Time Walk against combo decks. Giving 2 or 3 Humans a +1 attack boost matters a lot when you want to seal the deal or close the window/door for your opponent. Pontiff is also a very important cards against Pyromancer for obvious reasons. I would suggest at least 2 main deck Pontiff right now. There is also a surprise value with Mayor and/or Pontiff. In the later turns you can provide your 'small' bears a +2/+2 boost. Just watch those Merfolk decks with their Lords, it can be surprisingly effective. Our Lords (Humans) are more versatile in my opinion.

Dark Confidant and Noble Hierarch are both strong choices as well. But the question is if you want to go for card and mana advantage right now. Thalia and Priest do represent a form of card advantage anyway, and it seems to me that Notion Thief seems like a more brutal way to generate disparity resource wise ((compared to Dark Confidant). That said, I would keep Noble Hierarch Around, it does give more +1 bonuses which further strengthens the 'Lord' department. But you also want to jump into the 3 and 4 casting cost area as fast as possible. Another important aspect of Notion Thief is that it has flash, just like Containment Priest. You want a cluster of these instant speed cards in your deck. You need to take the Flash ability into account, try to build in a way that your lines of play are build towards this ability.

I have a strong and positive regard towards using Dack Fayden alongside Containment Priest. It further improves your chances of countering cards like Tinker, makes your Workshop match up better, helps to dig. Again, Dark Confidant seems slow right now, and I rather dig 2 cards and do no card advantage than to slowly (if the Dark Confidant survives) make some cards. Besides, Dack does not trigger an Oath of Druids and devastates the opponent alongside a Notion Thief.

I also want Sensei Top, helps to use mana more efficiently and with a Dack Fayden, you are digging nicely through your deck.




As for the 'non-human' creatures... Aven Mindcensor seems like a card you want around. It has the flash and will fit in nicely, and it bolsters the defenses against powerful tutoring that could otherwise result in a disaster.

I also believe that Engineered explosives is a card that combo's with Containment Priest. This is because Explosives takes out normal small creatures and especially Tokens. This further helps the battle against Bridge from Below, Delver and Pyromancer. EE also works nice with Thalia, giving it extra counters using the tax in your advantage. In addition, even if you draw your Priest a bit later, you can still stabilize the board with an Explosives. The same way Dack can help against an already resolved Tinker. You want both pre and post outs against certain problems. This is why I think Trinket Mage is a good option to search/solve and make some CA. It finds Top, Chalice (1 Chalice with a couple Trinkets gives the Trinket mage a 'hatebear' label), Explosives. Just make sure you don't blow up your own Wolf army .

Rough copy pasted list from cockatrice for inspiration:
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Mayor of Avabruck
4 Containment Priest
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Notion Thief
4 Mana Confluence
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Strip Mine
4 City of Brass
1 Karakas
1 Time Walk
1 Ancestral Recall
2 Aven Mindcensor
2 Gemstone Mine
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Black Lotus
3 Wasteland
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Dack Fayden
2 Trinket Mage
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Chalice of the Void
2 Nearheath Pilgrim

[xouman]

Nice innovation Guli However I'm less sold with this build than other you created before:

Cotv - explosives. You have lots of cards in curve 0, 1, 2 and 3. While you have caverns to avoid countering your creatues, it's risky.

While you don't play confidants, still are some lands that cost you life. Yes, I see the pilgrims help with that, but i'm not sure thet are good enough (I'll have to test them, sorry).

However I like the usual suspects (thalia + wastelands, thief + fayden, noble + mayor + humans...). What about using also prophetic flamespeaker? Since you don't play countermagic, you can play your threats most of the time. I just feel that "fair decks" as delver have the edge once they can overdraw you.