Okay, what I was calling Arena lands you call 4th Ed. foils. Done and done.

Man, I wish I could get a hold of print run info so I could bring a little objectivity into it. I'm tempted to allow users to set up their own pimpness ranking order, but then people could just pick Revised everything and get 100% pimped certification. Revised is clearly not pimped. Clearly.

I've never heard of 4th Edition foils. Are they on http://www.magiclibrary.net ?

I've tried poking around for print runs and came up with nothing conclusive. I wouldn't have a clue how to estimate how many APAC land packs were distributed, for example. This problem covers the whole board, not only lands, since I'm including the different languages and printings. I mean, if I were actually working on this.  

Edit: FWIW, I personally love Unglued lands and I rate them much higher on that list, probably second after Guru, like Jacob. I just wanted to spur discussion.

So let's say that hypothetically I were putting together an application to track your deck's pimpness. How would people rate the pimpness of the various lands? I'm curious to see if there is a strong consensus or if it's really a matter of personal preference.

I suppose mine might go something like this... I can't even really decide.

Guru
APAC
Euro
Arena
Urza's Saga Foil
Unglued
Alpha
Beta
...

kirdape3's argument is exactly why I haven't officially made the switch yet. But I gotta think that either Deep Analysis or Gush has to go. 3x Wonder just feels more right.

I'll agree that I've been trying to fit in the third Wonder maindeck, and Gush was probably the one to go. There have been so many games where I've noted if I had WonderTwinPowerActivated, I would have just won the game. I mean, it's not a good sign when I'm up against a wall and my opponents say "Looking for Wonder?" on more than one occassion.

The last local tourney I played in was 50% Goblins (2 FCG, 1 crazy sligh), and I came packing 3 Chills in place of the SoFIs. I'd love to tell you how they worked out, but I never drew one. I've been having a seriously difficult time against FCG, such that I'm probably going to switch decks to something that has better game against it.

I used to use Gunmetal, then I switched over to Super Black. I may switch back. I find that with the Japanese sleeves, after a bit of play they get stuck to each other, and they don't "glide" against each other smoothly.

Also, they don't fit in Rook capsules. At least not the one I bought. Blarg.

Some new brand called "MAX" has shown up in my local shop. Has anyone tried those out yet?

With so many of Vintage's finest berating any use of Standstill, I have to wonder if there's a better replacement for it.

Shoehorning an additional draw engine seems clunky, and I'm not sure what other counters the deck wants. More MisDs and Stifles would seem pretty craptacular. Maindecked Fire/Ice seem the most versatile, especially if there are going to be Welders around.

While I wouldn't advocate it as a maindeck choice, at the EC Vintage Championships I lost in the top 16 to the guy playing 3 Firestorm maindecked, which completely wrecked my U/G Madness. Maybe if you're expected tons of aggro?

One Eyed Jacque's is continuing its attempt to beef up its Type 1 scene. They can only start doing power tournaments if people start showing up regularly, so come support the scene!

Where: One Eyed Jacques, 3104 W Cary St, Richmond VA
When: Saturday, June 5th, 12:00 PM
What: Type 1, 5 proxies allowed
Entry Fee: $7
Prize: All entry fees get redistributed as store credit, possibly some other throw-ins.

If you can run 4 of all of your combo pieces, why wouldn't you use Consultation or Spoils of the Vault?

I had a take on a similar idea:

Land Before Time
Legendary Land

T: Add 1 to your mana pool.

When ~this~ is put into a graveyard from play, search your library for a basic land of each basic land type and put them into play. Then shuffle your library.

I guess they're not so similar mechanically, but in flavor.

Edit: ooh, I thought I was being smart about mana symbols, but phpBB is smarter.

If you're going for the cutest swing-to-win route, I would think [card]Astral Steel[/card] would be the preferred method.

My first era of Magic was Revised through Homelands.

4 Urza's Tower
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Red Mana Battery
4 red fallen empires storage land
4 Mana Flare
1 Fastbond
1 Channel
1 Fork
4 Fireball
4 Disintegrate
...

You see where this is going. I either won with a 120-point Fireball or lost horribly to Blue Elemental Blast. Those were the days.

This time around, it was $7 entry, and everyone got a Japanese token figure. Top 3 got a few picks of the new DCI land.

Yep, I played in it today. If there had been more notice, I would have posted something here about it. I'm sure most people were at Regionals anyway.

When he says budget, what he really means is insanity. I took careful notes to try to write a report about it, but it wasn't even worth it. The field was such:

1 Powered Stax-ish beatdown
1 U/G Madness
1 Extended Rock
1 Extended Angry Hermit
1 Type 2 Mono-White Control
1 Type 2-ish U/G Mesmeric Orb

I think a lot of people just weren't aware that it was going to be Vintage so they got stuck playing with what they had. Hopefully it'll settle down next month.

http://www.themanadrain.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=10990

http://www.themanadrain.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=13955

http://www.themanadrain.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=15605

Search is your friend.

Actually, that's how my interest in Type 0 began. A local shop was holding unrestricted tournaments, and kids with really bad Elf decks were winning. I had sent Rakso an email asking for help, and I eventually posted here for help. Jacob Orlove eventually proposed probably the best super-budget Type 0 deck...



Underground Sea may be pushing the limits of what you call budget, but if you ever want to play any real Vintage you may as well get them now. I suppose you could just cut them for any Glimmervoids or City of Brasses you have laying around if it gets to that point.

I think you could probably also do an unrestricted DARgon deck that would be pretty nutty, but I'm not familiar enough with it to propose a decklist.

I was with U/G Madness in the match next to you, SilverKing (I remember the Titans and Loti). I'm positive he went off on turn 3 in game 3, because he had three lands in play, and there was really nothing I could do about it.

I think he went off on turn 3 in game 2 as well...

Me: Green source, Rootwalla
Him: Taiga, Crypt, Food Chain
Me: Land, Mongrel
Him: Nothing of consequence
Me: Swing with Mongrel, pitch 2 Deep Analysis. I flashback a Deep Anal and draw Force of Will with no other blue sources. If I had held back on throwing away the second Deep Anal I could have forced his Recruiter next turn and started dropping Wurms. I feel like I could have won that had I not made that play mistake.

But still, the fact that I, with very little real Vintage experience, took Madness to a 4-2 finish probably speaks something of that deck's awesomeness. That or turn 2 Null Rod just poos all over my opponents all day.

I'm fairly sure the deck I posted would win, if it went first. If you're really playing games with these, it's almost always going to come down to a coin flip. I suppose if you really wanted to play actual games of Type 0, you could consider all 0-casting cost spells banned. That might make it reasonably interactive.

This is why I was trying to approach it from a theoretical, analytical standpoint rather than making decks to play against each other. To start, I tried making the most consistent first-turn kill deck I could with the Limited (as in Alpha/Beta) card pool. Then I added each set in order of its release to the card pool and made the deck that way. I only managed to do a couple sets before bright, shiny objects distracted me, but you can see the direction I was headed. Once we can see how this deck changes as the card pool grows, we can start to compare the differences and maybe come up with a way to quantitate them.

And yes, for my purposes I'm considering all ante, dexterity, Unglued, and soon to be Unhinged cards banned.

Ah, I guess I didn't search Workstation hard enough. Filters and searches confuse and frighten me. Now that I know the idea's been done, I agree with Bram.

*Although this card would have been AWESOME in my mana battery-storage land-fireball deck 10 years ago.*

For what it's worth, this would be my take on the idea.

Delayed Fireball
1R
Enchantment

At the beginning of your upkeep, put a charge counter on ~this~.

Sacrifice ~this~: ~this~ deals X damage to target creature or player, where X is equal to the number of charge counters on ~this~.

R: Put a charge counter on ~this~.

I'm not sure if the single red cost of the second activated ability is too strong, it seems like it would balance the weakness of being an enchantment. I dunno.

I'm not sure I understand the point of having delay counters if you can just remove them all at once for the same effect. I also think it's confusing to have to keep track of the original cost of X in addition to the number of counters on it.

I have a friend who swears [card]Fiery Justice[/card] is the greatest multiplayer card ever printed. It's almost drinking-game-like in its quality.

Yeah that definitely should have been a can counter spells played using Madness. What a horrible place to make a typo. Sorry for the confusion.

My Judge certificate (that I never actually got, *cough*DCI*cough*) is getting a little rusty, so I'll take a stab at these.

1. You can't counter a spell when it is played using madness. You can counter a flashed back spell, as it goes onto the stack as normal. Cycling is not a casting cost at all, it's an activated ability of a card in your hand.

2. No.

3. I think you're confusing the meaning of the term "priority." If two abilities trigger at the same time, you place them on the stack in APNAP (active player/non-active player) order. First, the active player puts any abilities he controls onto the stack in any order he wishes, then the non-active player does the same.

4. Yes, this is a triggered ability that will go on the stack and require priority to be passed in order for it to resolve. When you are given priority, you can respond by casting instants or using abilities.

5. I assume you mean you want to use your Wasteland to destroy your opponent's Wasteland before it can target your Underground Sea. In which case, no you cannot. Your opponent activates his Wasteland's ability, and when he pays the cost for that ability, his Wasteland is sacrificed. When you receive priority, you are certainly able to activate your own Wasteland, but your opponent's will no longer be in play for you to target.

I think the old sideboard I used to play with was:

4 REB
4 Pyroblast
4 Price of Progress
3 Threaten

I'm thinking the Threatens should be replaced with Rack and Ruins... other than that, I don't know enough about Vintage sideboarding yet  

First and foremost, if your friend wants to play with Goblins competitively, he needs to make the jump up to Food Chain Goblins. Vegeta2711's excellent primer is a good place to start: http://www.themanadrain.com/primers/fcg.htm

The problem with Sligh these days is that it simply cannot kill as fast as it used to, and it can easy be hosed with Chalice or 3Sphere. Most decks now have a fundamental turn of 2, Sligh usually is setup for its kill on turn 3.

That being said, I still love playing Sligh for mindless fun. So I'll try to give your friend some advice, if I'm way off base on something I'm sure someone will come along and correct me. Here we go...

Why only three fetchlands? This is the one deck that wants to take advantage of all 8 fetches. They also help get your Barbarian Ring online faster, even though I'd say running just 1 is a bad idea. I would cut it, as you'd normally want to have them dead before you hit threshold, otherwise go ahead and run 4.

Shocks over the fourth Fireblast and Incinerate? Definitely cut the Shocks, and add the last Fireblast and Incinerate. You should also probably be playing with 4 Goblin Grenades, and the 4th Reckless Charge is also worth looking at, although everyone has a different opinion on it (I say no Charges).

Jackal Pup and Goblin Cadets are definitely 4-ofs, no question. Cut the Ball Lightnings, as they're just a Drain target and lack synergy with the rest of the deck. Add 4 Goblin Piledrivers, 4 Goblin Lackeys, and 2 or 3 Siege-Gang Commanders.

I find Cursed Scroll to be too slow, and easily taken care of with all the Null Rods and artifact removal running around. If you feel like you need the board control, Lavamancer is better (this is another place where 8 fetches help a lot, if you go this route).

Cut the Strip and Wastelands. I think it's pretty critical to make your first three mountain drops, and this deck isn't trying to disrupt your opponent, just kill them. Also cut Fork, Fork is a reactive spell, and this is the furthest thing from a reactive deck. I also agree that Wheel of Fortune is bad, other decks will be able to take better advantage of it than you a lot of the time.

I've tried to keep my advice pointed towards a direct, balls-out aggro deck that will have the opponent dead on turn 3 or 4. I don't think it's as competitive as it used to be, and maybe there is a compromise that could be made (with Null Rods, Strips)  that would help it out in certain metagames, but that's for someone much smarter than me to say.

Hope that helps.

I've been searching around for print run information myself, and have come up short. But this site might help you identify your cards:

http://www.magiclibrary.net/sets.html

Ahh okay. In that case, let's mix it up...

56 Mystic Snake
2 Island
2 Forest

Didn't Mark Rosewater already kinda cover this?

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/daily/mr93

I realize you're using basic lands, but it's essentially the same idea.